Gripe w/ Rec.gov

[narc1370]

So I received a cancellation from rec.gov today, telling me that my wilderness permit cannot be issued with my current entry for 6/15/23 (Tamarack Flat, Yosemite), because Tioga Road remains closed. What upsets me, is bullet point #2, that states wilderness permits are non-refundable. So my choices are to find another trailhead that has availability or monitor the website for cancellations.

In situations that are completely out of my control (Tioga still closed), I don't understand how I cant get refunded. I don't have much of a desire to do any of the trailheads that are open and available. I know it's only $15, and I'll still be able to pay my mortgage, lol, but if I'm paying for goods that can't be provided, I should not be out of money for it. It's the principal of the thing. In looking at the trailhead info for Yosemite, there are a ton of permits that were issued for all trailheads off Tioga, including Lyell Canyon, Cathedral Lakes, Sunrise, Glen Aulin, May Lake etc that are also SOL... That's a ton of free money.

Maybe I'm just grumpy because I'm itching to get to the mountains and mother nature isn't cooperating, so maybe ignore this rant...

[Lenier]

I'm sure glad Booz Allen "reinvented" the recreation.gov experience.

[c9h13no3]

Join the day hiking dark side.

[John Harper]

Have you tried to contact them about a refund? Nonrefundable may mean that if you cancel, no refund. But, if they cancel, you should get a refund. Please contact them and let us know the result.

John

[JayOtheMountains]

Ethically, you should get a refund, since it wasn't you that changed the condition of the access point and due to natural causes and current road maintenance it's currently inaccessible. The park should offer you a permit for that trail - giving you the option to access that point akin to "winter" rules; or refund you.

Searching the literature on the Yosemite Conservacy, Yosemite NPS, and Rec.gov, I did not locate verbiage that would cover natural causes or a park-instituted cancellation. Rec.gov does state that reservations are non-refundable, but that is not duplicated on the wilderness info section for YNP website. Such is worrying since reservations were refunded during flood events and fire events in recent memory. The same should be applied to excessive and unplanned snow accumulation. Unfortunately I also didn't overtly see a place to lodge complaints, but you can request a refund (how to request a refund via rec.gov) which would be adjudicated by the park or assigned wilderness concessionaire and NOT rec.gov. If there's a notes or reason section, I'd include a smartly written statement about this.

[Harlen]

Hey narc1370, one of us has bad information. I just cancelled an 8 person, WP from Sierra NF/Rec.gov, and they said they'll be sending me a Treasury check for most of it back. I was pleased, but now I wonder if I was misinformed. I hope you do get a refund, because you deserve it more than we do. You having been cancelled by circumstances out of your control, and me having to cancel due to my own damned skiing out of control (*broke me ankle).
Here's hoping you'll be treated fairly. Ian.

[narc1370]

I pulled a permit for Mt. Langley for May 22, 2023. When I knew that would be a pipe dream due to the snow, I cancelled it. They refunded me my money. But I'm assuming it was because I cancelled it a few months before I was to begin the trip. I'm going to try and request the refund, just to see what answer I get. Thank you for all the responses!

[Wandering Daisy]

Yosemite has an entirely different permit system than the Forest Service. You do not get an entire refund if you cancel a Forest service permit- you get the "permit" cost refunded, but not the rec.gov fee. Rec.gov is just a payment portal with its fee supposedly to cover their costs. Each entity had its own fee with its own refund policy on top of that.

Personally I like Yosemite permit system (at least if it is the same as last year) where there is a lottery and then left over permits are given out later. I think they even have first-come for whatever is left over. I think what they are saying is that you can reapply at a later date at no extra cost and that includes if you get a slot based on left over lottery or even a first-come. They may have changed it this year, but worth a call to the wilderness office in Yosemite Valley and ask questions.

[narc1370]

Personally I like Yosemite permit system (at least if it is the same as last year) where there is a lottery and then left over permits are given out later. I think they even have first-come for whatever is left over. I think what they are saying is that you can reapply at a later date at no extra cost and that includes if you get a slot based on left over lottery or even a first-come. They may have changed it this year, but worth a call to the wilderness office in Yosemite Valley and ask questions.

I agree. For me, permits have actually become easier to get in Yosemite. I will reach out and see what answers I can get. It's atleast worth a phone call.

[JayOtheMountains]

Hey narc1370, one of us has bad information. I just cancelled an 8 person, WP from Sierra NF/Rec.gov, and they said they'll be sending me a Treasury check for most of it back. I was pleased, but now I wonder if I was misinformed. I hope you do get a refund, because you deserve it more than we do. You having been cancelled by circumstances out of your control, and me having to cancel due to my own damned skiing out of control (*broke me ankle).
Here's hoping you'll be treated fairly. Ian.

You's guys' are talking about two different agencies, now. USDA vs NPS. USDA forest unit for Sequoia NF has different rules than the Yosemite NPS unit.
Recreation.gov doesn't care what unit you're trying to access or make payment to, they're just the point of sale reservation system that has been contracted to facilitate the reservation.