Challenges in getting permits this year

[alpinemike]

For some perspective, does anyone remember back in the day reserving wilderness permits by POSTAL MAIL? Oh boy, that was painful. I have a vague memory of Yosemite and SEKI being mail-only well into the 2000's.

I sure remember these days! I remember some of my first permits were like this! I'll admit this online system is much better indeed than that, but as with any change there's bugs in the system.

I'm amazed at the luck you had last year though!

[LMBSGV]

Yes, the good old days before Recreation.gov. I remember the excitement of getting the envelope in the mail and opening it to see the exact date for the permit. For SEKI, Inyo, and Yosemite I always would pick two or three different entry dates and be especially pleased if I got the entry date I wanted. And there was faxing SEKI at midnight. From 1978 until the late 1980s, we always got our permit either the day before or the morning of, no reservations, and we always got what we wanted even if it was Rafferty Creek or Cathedral.

I think what’s happening now is a combination of all the suggestions, from a group where each person is simultaneously trying for a permit to bots (commercial outfitters) to people overbooking. Inyo seems by far the worst for abuse of the system. Also, I think Flamingo is correct on the North Lake/South Lake loop. The having to refresh at exactly 7:00 am and then fill in the group size, click the Commercial Outfitter button, then scroll down to your trailhead means the speed of person and the internet connection is the more important factor.

I’m wondering if ”Permit will be canceled as a No-Show unless printed or issued before the deadline” is an attempt to deal with this issue. Does that mean people will be able to get same day walk up permits in Inyo?

As others have suggested, I’d like to see Inyo and SEKI go to a lottery system like Yosemite for the popular trailheads. Of course, that means you have to have people spending time (and thus money) doing the lottery.

One way also to deal with this issue, in part, and also help better preserve the wilderness, is for the group size of 15 changed to 10. But I don’t think that is going to happen.

[wildhiker]

I wrote up my experience trying for late July permit for one person for Bishop Pass in another related topic:
http://www.highsierratopix.com/communit ... 20#p170309
Failed the first time, succeeded the next day.
-Phil

[Lumbergh21]

Yes, I had a hard time getting a permit for the Pine Creek trailhead this year. Last year it was no biggie, as I was only booking for myself and had no problem getting a "walk-up" permit two weeks ahead. Unfortunately that isn't an option for my planned August trip this year, as I will be going with two other guys, one whose schedule is not nearly as flexible as mine, so I didn't want to take the chance of not getting a permit for his days off. I had the same thought as Alpine Mike. I think with the new system people are grabbing up mutiple permits as soon as they become avaiable "just in case". The more this continues, the more it will build until it becomes a lottery like Whitney or Yosemite.

I do still prefer this to trying to get through to Yosemite or SEKI by fax, never knowing if they even received it because as fax machines go theirs seemed to be particularly poor.

[Mtncaddis]

I agree that the challenges of getting these highly competitive permits through rec.gov are far less than ideal but I really like the fact that I can print the permit myself a week before the trip rather than having to pick it up in person shortly before hitting the trail.

[arkheel]

I was able to get a permit yesterday morning for Cottonwood Lakes. I was on the Recreation.gov at exactly the starting time (10 a.m. EST) and got through the process quickly. One of my hiking buddies was trying for a Cottonwood Pass permit and got the error message that there was high demand and no permits were available, or words to that effect. I'm pretty sure that I was able to get through because I work at a major research university, and was accessing Recreation.gov on our lightening fast university wifi, while my hiking buddy was on their home internet (AT&T fiber).

I went on Recreation.gov this morning to watch the process go down. I specifically kept an eye on the Cottonwood Lakes and Cottonwood Pass permits. Within two minutes, all the permits were gone. A few minutes later, a couple of Cottonwood Lakes permits became available. After about 30 minutes, a few more permits opened up for both of the locations. So yeah, it does seem that people are releasing their hold on the permits after they communicate with their group to see who got a permit.

[alpinemike]

A few minutes later, a couple of Cottonwood Lakes permits became available. After about 30 minutes, a few more permits opened up for both of the locations. So yeah, it does seem that people are releasing their hold on the permits after they communicate with their group to see who got a permit.

This is especially encouraging to hear! And we can only hope that is happening for other locations as well. Thank you for sharing! This gives me some hope in the process and the people. No solution will ever be perfect. We live in an imperfect world, but if people understand that others deserve a chance this system will work out much better.

[sambieni]

Not in love w the new Yosemite process - namely the long delay b/w lottery week and the remaining permit week, plus as relates to SEKI and Inyo timing. They are not all aligned timewise so feel it can lead to some hording/gambling on more permits than need be for the timeframe as hedge against being w/out anything.

Also, I do not get the Yosemite lotto. I put in for HI -> Illouette as my first choice w 2 people + 3 other options. I got totally shut out. Today, go on and see my first choice trailhead has 12 open spots. So I was happy, I could book that trail head as I wanted. But then how did I get shutout in the first place? Is it simply a matter of people winning, but not paying for their spaces and it goes back into the queue? Its really odd.

[westmatt]

I also was looking for Paiute Pass - in August. Took me four days but I got it (4 people). If I got shut out and then waited past the 'cart' expiration time and refreshed the page, I would inevitably see one or two slots available, which didn't do me any good, but would work with a smaller party. No question that the east side is more impacted.

[SenorNeiltz]

Not in love w the new Yosemite process - namely the long delay b/w lottery week and the remaining permit week, plus as relates to SEKI and Inyo timing. They are not all aligned timewise so feel it can lead to some hording/gambling on more permits than need be for the timeframe as hedge against being w/out anything.

Also, I do not get the Yosemite lotto. I put in for HI -> Illouette as my first choice w 2 people + 3 other options. I got totally shut out. Today, go on and see my first choice trailhead has 12 open spots. So I was happy, I could book that trail head as I wanted. But then how did I get shutout in the first place? Is it simply a matter of people winning, but not paying for their spaces and it goes back into the queue? Its really odd.

This happened to me multiple times this summer with the Yosemite lottery as well. Once with a Lyell Canyon permit and another with a White Wolf--Pate Valley. Shut out in lottery, check when the window clears and "viola" multiple permits open. Now granted I checked the morning of release and they probably wouldn't have been there long but it did feel like I got cheated out of the money for the lottery submission.