Wind River Range - Late July 2023 - Advice?

[Balsam]

Hello Folks! We're planning a high route style trip in the Winds. It's a combination of WD's book ideas with parts of the Dixon High Route. Notably we'll be going over Knapsack Col, Indian Pass and across Alpine Lakes, and so on. Beginning Aug 24. 8 day trip. We are three fit and experienced off trail hikers.

I live in the north cascades where NRCS data show snow water equivalent at 5% of median and high elevation snow conditions look like August already. This after an average winter. I believe the Winds also had an average winter, and NRCS data show SWE of 35% of median (12% of average) there. So I thought it would be a great year for a late July trip. However, I understand it's been a cool spring and things are melting very slowly. It appears that the coolish weather is forecast to continue for now. I'm concerned that our start date is too early to safely and enjoyably traverse some of the higher country.

Based on this, I'm seeking advice:

First of all, fact check. Is it true that there is still a lot of snow at higher elevations for this time of year in the Winds?

Is July 28 too early to do this trip given current conditions? I'm wondering about lingering snow making passes more difficult/dangerous (e.g., Knapack, Alpine, Knifepoint, etc).

How likely is it that the snow will melt like gangbusters in the next month?

Are microspikes likely to be a necessity? If so, would you recommend a step up to actual crampons? Ice axe?

I know mosquitoes are prodigious in the Winds. Is late July likely to be thick with them this year?

Does a forum such as this one exist that is focused on the Winds?

Thank you very much in advance!

[Wandering Daisy]

The NRCS data is quite inaccurate for late spring, June particularly. They just do not have a lot of sensors and the data unfortunately is in % averages, which can swing wildly because a few inches of new snow be a large percentage of a small amount on the ground. Not sure I explained that very well. My take is that although cool the precipitation has been mostly rain with a few inches of snow at the very highest locations. The peak snowpack was near normal (a bit higher) on the average. Long term NWS forecast for July is for a slight chance of wetter than normal (may be lots of afternoon showers) and normal to slightly warmer temperatures.

I think late July would be fine but there will be significant snow on the southeast side of Knapsack Col, and the Knifepoint Glacier may still have some current year snow. I have used crampons on the Knifepoint Glacier, and it will allow faster travel, but the main advantage is keeping feet above the water flow. There often is an inch of water running down the glacier. I have never tried it in micro-spikes; it is not steep so they should work but you may get wet feet. That said, I generally do the northern part of the range in mid-August. I have only walked part way up Knapsack Col from the Titcomb side. The Peak Lake side is mostly grassy slopes- some talus. It is steep up top. The snow generally softens after a few hours of sun. I spent many years in the 1970's on snow with aggressive tread mountaineering boots, but no crampons, always being able to kick at least a small step. I did have an ice axe. Nowadays I only carry trekking poles. Wind River snow rarely gets hard like "Sierra Cement" until very late season, if at all.

Depends on what pass you take from the North Fork of Bull Lake Creek into Brown Cliffs. What I call the "Goat Packers" pass is the easiest and probably the best bet. It may be too early for Alpine Col (Skurka's route) but it is a popular route and may have steps in the snow.

River crossings could be more of a problem. You definitely will have wading.

So far, I plan on going to the Winds also- starting about mid-July, mid-range out Scab Creek and onto the Reservation and a loop from Elkhart to Brown Cliffs. I have two or so trips in the north for August. Not sure exactly what I will do- as always I have several more "trip plans" than I could do in several years! But with no permits required, I just play it as it goes with weather and conditions once I get there.

To play it 100% safe, ice axe and crampons would be good, otherwise, be willing to turn back or adjust your route base on conditions (this is what I do because I do not like to carry heavy gear and use it once).

[Balsam]

Thank you Daisy. This is very helpful. A couple additional questions...

You said..."Depends on what pass you take from the North Fork of Bull Lake Creek into Brown Cliffs. What I call the "Goat Packers" pass is the easiest and probably the best bet. It may be too early for Alpine Col (Skurka's route) but it is a popular route and may have steps in the snow."

We probably wont be very near the NF Bull Ck. In fact, we're now thinking of skipping Knapsack/Titcomb and simply going from Elkhart TH - Indian Pass - KP Glacier and then immediately over "Alpine Pass" dropping straight down to Alpine Lakes - then hook up with some of your Central WR routes.

Is the Alpine 'Pass' I described the same as your Alpine 'Col'? How difficult is my Alpine Pass and why might it be more difficult in late July than, say, late Aug? The Alan Dixon WRHR goes that way and from what I've read, it doesn't sound too bad (class 2-3?). Maybe they're all going later in the season though.

What river crossings strike you as most troublesome for late July?

The more I read in your book, the more tempted I am to extend the trip days and do the Central WR Scenic Tour (#30). If one were to do that, what potential late July trouble spots jump out at you?

I'm guessing bugs will be bad late July, yeah? I lived in arctic AK long enough to wonder about that!

I'm enjoying reading your WR TR's from last summer. They give me perspective and help me understand some the possible pitfalls.

Thank you very much WD.

[Wandering Daisy]

Yes, Alpine Pass is Alpine Col. The north side is steep and if covered with snow it can require crampons and ice axe to be safe. It is also the route of the two popular "high routes", Dixon's and Skurka's. I have never gone over it myself but have been up close on both north and south sides. Although north side is steep, the south side has abundant talus- easier to walk in total snow but snow at melt stage over talus can be difficult. You can post hole between boulders. The three passes farther east are lower in elevation and melt out earlier. I prefer the "Goat Friendly " pass which takes off from Onion Lake to Brown Cliffs. It is mainly walking up a moderately steep grassy slope then across a high plateau and dropping again on a gentle slope. I named it because this is the standard route that goat packers use. It also has distinct route markers that look like headstones. In June, "Bloody Hell" pass is the most efficient when covered solid with snow. It has a lot of very unstable talus when snow is melted.

I think Alpine Col has become easier with repeated use by the two popular routes and probably has cairns marking it. It is slow due to all the talus.

Glacier-fed rivers do not recede late season - they just switch from new snow melt to glacial ice melting. All depends on the summer heat. It really warms up late July and glacial streams can have peak flow. They fluctuate daily- up to a foot lower early to mid-morning. Gannett Creek, the Dinwoody, Grasshopper Creek and the Downs Fork all are difficult, as is the lower NF Bull Lake Creek. You will be south of them.

The Central WR Scenic Tour is route 28 in the 2nd edition. I think creeks on that route will be fine- still some wading but nothing impossible. You may have to go up or downstream to find the best crossing. SF Boulder Creek can be difficult up by Raid Lake but you can always just go around the upper end of Cross Lake. It could be another wet summer given the El Nino. Last year I got caught in a severe rainstorm and water levels in the creeks rose as much as 4 feet. In that case you just have to wait until it goes down.

Anyway, good luck. Maybe I will run across you!

[dave54]

Just came from the Bighorns. They are wet wet wet. The FS closed a lot of roads because they were so muddy vehicles were sinking to the axles and destroying the roadbed. Still plenty of snow at higher elevations. On the plus side wildflowers are incredible, and wildlife have not yet moved to the higher elevations, lots of wildlife right along the highways.
Currently at Little Bighorn Battle site and water is everywhere. Every little draw and rill has water flowing. Didn't plan it, but I am here on the date of the battle.
I would expect the Winds to be similar.

[Wandering Daisy]

A wet June does not necessarily mean a wet rest of the summer. I have been in many wet and even snowy Junes where after a bug-hell first two weeks in July, summer became "normal"- typical afternoon storms. I would rather have it this way than in a drought.

If you look at today's Riverton NWS office website, they show the June rainfall to date- the Bighorns got nearly 5 times average, but Wind Rivers only about 2-3 times "normal" for Lander (east side). The "normal" is not much, so the 2.8 inches seems like a lot. I am not too worried about going in even as early as mid-July. Last year was quite rainy- you can read my trip reports to see what I encountered.

If you start at Elkhart Park, the road to the trailhead is paved. Scab Creek road should not be impacted much by a rain. Big Sandy road does get temporarily washed out.

https://www.weather.gov/riw/weatherstory
Here is the report- not sure when they will take it down

[Wandering Daisy]

I just looked up some of my trips and 2009 was a winter and cold, wet June, similar to this year. I started July 2 and did four short trips in the southern part of the range (which mostly melts out earlier than the north, some exceptions of course). Gradually things greened up and flowers bloomed- very nice by end of July. First trip (Scab Creek TH to Bonneville Lake and Lee Lake) I could not cross a creek so had to divert several miles around the headwater lake of the creek. Lots of patchy snow, frozen lakes. Second trip (Little Sandy TH to Frozen Lakes), log crossing of only deep creek, lots of snow up high, grasses beginning to green. Third Trip (Atlantic Lakes, beginning to look like summer!), still snow, lakes open. Fourth Trip, Mountain Sheep Lake from Sweetwater TH. Lakes open, waded streams, snow cornice on pass had a nice melt-out on edge, used crampons coming down, none going up. Flowers galore! A bit more evidence that your late July time frame would be OK. Maybe a bit sketchy up north along the divide.

A few photos

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[Balsam]

Thank you WD for these photos and to both you and dave54 for your thoughts. It's very helpful. And doubly so given your deep knowledge of the Winds WD. Truly, many thanks.

We're still hoping to make some version of this trip work for July 24. AND I remain cautious about the snowpack.

I've been playing with EOSDIS Worldview which allows one to compare imagery from two different dates. You can scroll back and forth in dates to find a cloud-free view and compare snowpack between years or months or days. The page is https://worldview.earthdata.nasa.gov

[Balsam]

I'm back with a more formed plan for the Winds and some specific questions. Having poured over the book and other online resources, we're sticking pretty closely to the Central Wind River Scenic Tour (#30 - #28 in later edition). 8 days beginning July 24. The full route as presented in the book includes Seneca Lk, Island Lk, Cook Lakes, Fall Creek Pass, Long Lake, Middle F Lake, Raid/Bonniville Col and suggested time is 12 days (with dayhikes).

DECISION POINT - We won't have time to do the full route so I'm trying to decide between two options (below). Which areas are not to be missed and afford reasonably enjoyable travel, views, solitude etc.? How best to use 8 days?

1) Cut the northern portion short -- i.e., begin by going go straight to Spider Lake/Alpine Pass or else Timico Lk/Upper Falls Creek Pass) and continue south as described in the book'. Is Spider Lk nicer than Timico (making Alpine Pass worth it)? If we did this, we might do Texas Pass & pass through the Cirque to Big Sandy if it doesnt add too much time. Not sure though.

2) Cut the southern portion short -- not sure what makes most sense here - suggestions welcome - perhaps begin at Scab Ck trailhead and catch the route at, say, Bonneville Basin area? Or trail to Middle Fork Lake and start there? What is best?

GOALS - Remoteness and alpine beauty are very important AND we'd like to also have fun and avoid a possible suffer-fest. So days on end of talus or technical passes and steep snow are not preferable (we're skipping Knapsack & Alpine Passes). We are capable route finders and experienced but we don't know the Winds. We'd like to pop over the divide at some point. Ideally, we'd like one layover day to explore. Not too worried about trailhead logistics.

ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS
1) I'd be curious how the following passes rank in terms of difficulty - here's my take, from easiest to hardest:

Falls Ck Pass - easiest
Cook Pass - east side of pass is okay but getting to G Lakes is tricky (?)
Wall Pass - I really dont understand difference in challenges b/t this and Cook Pass
Alpine Pass (west has slabs but not too bad if going up - east is easier side) -- how hard is this pass really? Say, compared to the SEKI xc passes from Palisade Lakes to Barret Lks Basin?

2) Bear spray - is it necessary? I always carry it in AK, but my inclination on this route is to leave it behind (and avoid camping at Golden Lks)

That should do it! Many thanks!!