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McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

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McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby EpicSteve » Sun Apr 13, 2014 11:59 pm

Using Maverick's "Suggestions for Requesting Trip Advice," I'd describe myself as a Level 4 and my partner on this trip as barely a level 3, but quite fit. Looking to avoid Class 3 terrain and hoping the Class 2 isn't too exposed. I've done a ton of searching and reading on these forums, as well as referring to multiple maps and Secor's book. There are two areas I can't seem to find much specific info on:

1. The pass between McGee Lakes and Davis Lake
2. Goddard Creek Pass (between Martha Lake and Ionian Basin)

Does that mean that these are relatively straightforward and inconsequential pass crossings? (Obviously any pass can become more serious with inclement weather, but otherwise...) Any info on that would be much appreciated. Also, if you feel like looking over my itinerary and letting me know if you think my mileages are reasonably close to reality, that would be helpful too. Eventually I'll plot this on NatGeo's TOPO! program, but haven't gotten to it yet.

Incidentally, Secor includes a decent amount of detail on Goddard Creek Pass, but he tends to "sandbag" non-climbers with brief, down-played descriptions, so I'm looking for opinions from mere mortals. :wink:

We'll be doing this hike during the first week in September. We plan to leave a car at South Lake and start at North Lake.

Day 1: North Lake Trailhead to Lower Lamarck Lake; over Lamarck Col, down Darwin Canyon to Darwin Bench [7 - 8 miles?]

Day 2: Descend to Evolution Valley and take JMT north about 1.5 to 2.0 miles to the east end of McClure Meadow; make a “difficult crossing” of Evolution Creek (might not be too difficult this year, with so little snowpack); go south and ascend McGee Canyon to McGee Lakes [4 - 6 miles?]

Day 3: Head south over “Pass 11,720+” to Davis Lake; cross from S shore to N shore at eastern peninsula; from Davis Lake’s outlet, go southwest and then south, following a bench at about 11,200’ and then climbing to another bench between 11,400’ and 11,600’ to the small lakes that lie about 1.0 mile NW of Mt. Goddard and about 0.8 mile N of Martha Lake [5.5 - 7.0 miles?]

Day 4: S to Martha Lake, then E over Goddard Creek Pass to Ionian Basin; make camp at the lake immediately SE of Mt. Goddard (I haven't had a chance to check exact elevations of unnamed lakes yet); ascend East Slope of Mt. Goddard if time and weather allow [3.5 - 4.0 miles?]

Day 5: Move camp to the lake immediately N of Scylla; ascend Northwest Slope of Scylla [3.5 - 4.0 miles?]

Day 6: Move camp to easternmost lake in Ionian Basin; ascend NE Ridge of Charybdis and West Slope of Black Giant if time and weather allow [3.5 miles to lake? Additional 3.0 – 4.0 miles to ascend peaks?]

Day 7: Cross Black Giant Pass N to JMT; S on JMT to Little Pete Meadow [7.0 - 8.5 miles?]

Day 8: S on JMT to Le Conte Ranger Station; hike Bishop Pass Trail to upper Dusy Basin [5.0 – 6.5 miles?]

Day 9: Cross Bishop Pass and exit at South Lake TH [6.0 – 7.5 miles?]

Oh and one more thing: Are there decent campsites at (or near) the lakes that I've mentioned in Ionian Basin? Most of the photos I've seen of the area make it look like the whole basin is just a sea of talus! :eek:
“I don’t deny that there can be an element of escapism in mountaineering, but this should never overshadow its real essence, which is not escape but victory over your own human frailty.”

- Walter Bonatti



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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby Wandering Daisy » Mon Apr 14, 2014 11:22 am

Being in good shape is good but the key to making the miles you have proposed is to be proficient at talus hopping with a pack on your back. I did almost the same route (excluding McGee Lakes) years ago August of a high snowpack year and I carried an ice axe. I had some troubles with cornices blocking routes (drop to Lake 11837) in the Ionian Basin, but this year that probably will not be an issue. The talus in Ionian Basin is blocky and sharp and pretty foot-stressing. I do not recall the passes being hard but they do require really good micro-route finding skills and you are lucky to do 1 mph. If you have had LOTS of off trail experience you probably will be OK. The only "plush" camping I have had in the Ionian Basin was at Chasm Lake. You will be able to find lots of small spots without talus and there are some constructed bivy sites. Campsites are all marginal. Not sure what you mean by "descent". Flat smooth campsites are at Lake 11592, south of Wanda Pass, however the outlet area is very windy. The Ionian Basin is a very unfriendly place in a lightning storm. Hopefully by September lightning will be over for the season. I would have a tent that has a small footprint. You may be hard pressed to find a spot for a large tent such as a 3-person tent. I do not recall good campsites at the upper lakes, that does not mean there are none. I just never looked for them.

At the southeast end of the westernmost arm of Davis Lake you have to go over a difficult rock buttress that most likely you will have to lower packs. Then I had to cross a very steep snow finger that a fall would send you right into the lake. This year that snow finger may be gone. The remainder of the traverse to Martha Lake is simply a matter of route finding. The benches are such that you have to go from one to another to traverse at the same elevation. I think most people traverse the north shore of Davis Lake. By the way, the biggest fish I ever tried to catch was on this arm of Davis Lake. I did not catch the fish.

From Chasm Lake to Black Giant Pass is easier travel. There was a somewhat steep snowfield on the north side of Black Giant Pass when I did it.

Your schedule seems to go to too many areas. Personally I would skip the drop to Evolution Valley and back up to McGee Lakes. What is your focus? If it is Ionian Basin, I would go there more directly. If all went well and you get ahead of schedule, you then could spend more time in Ionian Basin or a day in Dusy Basin. With your current schedule if weather goes bad or you go slower (altitude may slow you down on your ambitious first day), then you end up rushed in Ionian Basin. The upper Darwin Bench is worthy of a day or two itself.
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McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby Bluewater » Mon Apr 14, 2014 1:02 pm

I did a trip last summer that covered most of the areas on your itinerary and I've been through all of the rest (except McGee Cyn & Lakes) on previous trips. Darwin Bench was totally reasonable for me on day one, with some time left to take some pxts, find a good camp site and make dinner. The route from the northwest shore of Davis Lake, up to the bench to the northwest of Goddard and down to Martha is a fun and remote trip. The lakes on that bench are beautiful but mostly surrounded by rocks. There are a few nice waterfalls at the drop off on the south end toward Martha. Goddard Creek Pass is straightforward and I was able to follow a use trail even through the mostly rocky sections. I got stuck in a storm and could only find one small flat spot without rocks to camp on the south shore of the lake at the base of the east side of Goddard. . . and I searched for a while! I ran out of time in Ionian Basin and had to take another westerly route out the next day. I agree with WD that Ionian deserves much more time. I wanted to camp at Scylla Lake and do some of the climbing you have mentioned. From Helen Lake out via Dusy Basin and Bishop Pass is nice, but have you considered going back via Echo Col and through Sabrina Basin? It's a fun route and would take you right back to the start. Just an idea. There are so many places to explore there and all are all good :)


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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby AaronRDavis » Mon Apr 14, 2014 1:04 pm

Wandering Daisy wrote:Personally I would skip the drop to Evolution Valley and back up to McGee Lakes. What is your focus? If it is Ionian Basin, I would go there more directly. If all went well and you get ahead of schedule, you then could spend more time in Ionian Basin or a day in Dusy Basin.


I'd agree with this part. McGee canyon is very nice, however a better route might be to go from Darwin bench over to Evolution lk then Sapphire Lake, and climb the easy xcountry pass into the upper end of McGee. Pretty simple route up the Hermit from this area as well. From there, you could proceed with your route.
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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby EpicSteve » Mon Apr 14, 2014 10:01 pm

Thank you Wandering Daisy, Bluewater and AaronRDavis for sharing your opinions and experiences. I appreciate your thoughtful feedback (are we spoiled on these forums, or what?)

You're right WD: I didn't define what I meant by a "decent" campsite. I'm not talking deluxe - I don't mind having to walk a ways for water and so forth - but I am concerned about the footprint of my tent. When I hike solo (on the majority of my trips) I use a TarpTent Sublite Sil, which has a tiny footprint and can be pitched practically anywhere. But when traveling with a partner, we usually use my REI Quarterdome 3, which is an awesome tent for weathering a storm, but does have a rather large footprint. I'm starting to wonder if I should save Ionian for a solo trip or a trip where my partner also has a good bivy-sized shelter. Especially in view of what all of you have said about my (rough draft) itinerary being overly ambitious.

My buddy has repeatedly expressed a desire to go on one of my "epic" cross-country journeys with me, so one of my main goals on this trip is to avoid the JMT as much as possible and spend days at a time without seeing a constructed trail. McGee Canyon APPEARS pretty easy on the topo (but we all know those are famous last words! :lol: ), so I figured this route would allow us to parallel the JMT without actually getting on it for a while and I thought the part through McGee Canyon would be fairly quick. I hadn't really thought of focusing on any one area (ie, Darwin Bench vs. Ionian Basin), so much as I'd had this vision of passing through some high and wild country.

At one point I'd considered dropping from Darwin Bench to the JMT, north on JMT, then south up Goddard Canyon and then cutting over to the JMT via either Davis Lake/Wanda Lake or the aforementioned route through Ionian Basin. But it seemed like extra mileage with decreased XC, so I discarded the idea. I was aware that much of this trip is likely to be an enormous talus slog, but perhaps I've still underestimated that factor. Hmmm... :-k
“I don’t deny that there can be an element of escapism in mountaineering, but this should never overshadow its real essence, which is not escape but victory over your own human frailty.”

- Walter Bonatti
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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby tim » Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:34 am

I would also tend towards avoiding the drop and climb to McGee Lakes and just take Davis Lakes Pass from Wanda (viewtopic.php?f=31&t=9982) so you can spend more time around Martha Lake/Ionian Basin. Make sure you don't go all the way to the outlet of Davis Lakes, but instead head up the stream gully to the right of the hill (right side of this picture).

DSC04192 (1024x680).jpg
Davis Lakes outlet

There is a great campsite in the first patch of trees when you get into the North Goddard Creek drainage (big enough for our REI QuarterDome T3+) with an amazing view and easy access to water.

DSC04198 (1024x680).jpg
North Goddard Creek view

When you head over to Martha Lake, I think you need to get onto the ridge in the center of the picture below (probably easiest near the lake outlet) then traverse round to the right of the peak. We didn't do that, as we were just descending North Goddard Creek instead (viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9921).

DSC04196 (1024x680).jpg
Route to Martha Lake
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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby Mike M. » Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:03 pm

EpicSteve,

Ionian Basin is one of my favorite places in the Sierra. I've spent quite a a bit of time there over the years, including four hikes down Enchanted Gorge, all solo. It's stark, dramatic country without a tree in sight. Getting around in Ionian Basin itself is not difficult, even when you have snow to contend with (a non issue for you this September). Just realize you won't be hiking at three miles an hour. The area can be challenging in terms of route finding, especially if you're in a hurry. What looks simple on the map can in fact be quite involved. Just go with the flow of the geography and you can keep your hike at class 2 or lower. The worst talus and boulder fields are found going up to Black Giant Pass from the high lake, if my memory serves. Much of the terrain in Ionian Basin is made up of small shale-like pieces of broken rock, which is easy to walk on.

There is good camping on benches just below (east) of the head of Goddard Col, close to the high lake that flanks Goddard. Take your time to look around for a protected flat spot. You might have to walk a ways for water (but not too far). Look forward to fabulous views.

1975.033_filtered.jpg
Ionian Basin campsite, on bench just east of Goddard Col


Goddard Col and Goddard Creek Pass are straightforward from a route-finding perspective. By the way, there is an awesome protected campsite at Martha Lake, on the west side of the lake, south of the outlet.

IMG_6128.jpg
Route up to Goddard Col as seen from north edge of Martha Lake


There is poor camping at the lake just north of Scylla. I was there two years ago in crummy weather. We camped on the northern tip of the lake, below the col that leads to Lake 11,824. My brother set up his tent on a flat granite slab; I slept in a tube tent set up on a lumpy, grass-covered slope. Not the best campsite but the views from there were A+. (The lake just south of Wanda Pass is excellent for camping, with multiple places suitable for a three-person tent, but the Scylla site has better views.)

IMGP2262sony.jpg
Marginal sleep site on north shore of lake next to Scylla


IMGP2271corrected.jpg
Awesome views from this site


You'll find good to decent camping sites suitable for tents at or near the big lake just SW of Black Giant. It's a logical place to stop for the night, prior to your hike over Black Giant Pass and down to Little Pete Meadow.

The hike down to Colby Meadow and then up to McGee Lakes is very nice and I would recommend it. There is great camping at the isthmus on the middle lake, with fine views. By the way, crossing Evolution Creek is easy; it's not a difficult crossing except in early season. Leave the JMT at about the 9920 elevation right about where the "w" in the word "Colby Meadow" is on the old 15" series Mt. Goddard map. Then cross Evolution Creek, stay to the west of McGee Creek as you make your way up the "canyon" by eyesight. Don't worry about trying to find the trail; you'll intersect it soon enough before coming to a pretty valley. I went over Pass 11,720 in the 1980s but can't recall a thing, except for the views were great. The hike up to McGee Pass is easy cross country.
Last edited by Mike M. on Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby urnotreal » Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:48 pm

I hiked this route as a section of a longer thru hike last summer. I had been out for two weeks on my own before meeting up with a friend of mine (with plenty of backpacking experience, but most of it on trail) who was coming in fresh from civilization. In the end, she was completely fine, though we did a pretty good job of route finding for the most part. Figured I could offer a few more suggestions.

First off, it seems that most people start at North Lake, as you're planning to do (and I'm curious why this is). I was hiking from south to north, so I chose to start at South Lake. In the end, I think it made it easier for her to get used to the altitude and carrying a pack and whatnot as the first two days were fairly mild and completely on trail (camped in Dusy the first night and the base of Black Giant Pass the second). The day one hike up to Bishop Pass is pretty mellow and very scenic vs what seemed to be more of a slog up Ladmarck and a talus dance down the Canyon to the Bench.

The other thing we did differently was our route from Martha to Davis Lake. Rather than take the Secor route, we went over the saddle NW of Pk 12,964. Really liked the lakes on the 11,600 bench and it dropped us down onto one of my all time favorite campsites on the SE shore of the western Davis Lake (though your three man tent would be a no-go here).

Anyway, just a little more food for thought. All part of the fun of planning these things. This was probably my favorite leg of a 36 day trip. No matter how you do it, you won't be disappointed.

If you're interested, I've got a TR posted here:
http://pferranti.blogspot.com/2013/12/s ... d-leg.html
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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby RoguePhotonic » Tue Apr 15, 2014 11:32 pm

First I would consider going to the Mcgee Lakes as a good option as I found them to be very nice. If you are unsure of Secor's route which I have not taken it's quite easy to climb up the slope SE of the Mcgee Lakes and follow past the 3 small lakes that are above until you reach the highest one just under 11,720ft. From here head directly SE along the shoulder of Peak 12,240 at about 11,880 feet where you can drop down the shoulder to Davis Lakes Pass. It's all class 2.

Goddard Creek Pass is one I have lagged on adding to the forum. I have never taken the route noted on the images above but using it as a guide if you stay near lake level until you cross over that large green patch of grass coming down you can climb directly up from there until you reach some solid granite shelves. This is the only part that involves any sort of loose or annoying scrambling or route finding. As soon as you cut up and right from there you will be in the primary drainage coming down the pass which should be flowing. Follow this up until you reach the small lake. From here there are 3 options depending on where you are going in Ionian. Since you are heading for Goddard turn left and take the obvious slope there that will take you directly to the lake SE of Goddard. There is ONE camp site on the entire lake on the SW shore. You might be able to put another tent above this site but it will be a tight fit. If you look sharp there is a lake register at this camp site.

The lake North of Scylla I have not fully explored for camping. The one time I set up camp there I stayed about 100 yards or more from the lake directly West of it where a large open flat area is. Here you can find a few patches of ground that are covered in small rocks but are flat enough to sleep on if you have a decent pad. An alternative you might want to consider is to camp at the Lake NW of there *11,818*. It's made up sort of like 3 lakes connected. The NW peninsula between the two most Western pieces of the lake offers what I consider to be the best camping in all of Ionian. Nice flat dirt patches with even a couple small trees growing which might be the only ones in the whole basin. From your camp here it's an easy stroll up the slope to the base of Scylla. You only need to gain an extra 200 feet. From here you have the option of heading East to Lake 11,837 on your way to climbing Charybdis. Rounding the Southern shore of Lake 11,837 is an annoying task and you will likely encounter some class 3 but it can be done.

There is camping on Lake11,828 for you ascent of Charybdis on the North shore near the outlet.

When you climb the NE ridge of Charybdis do not follow the ridge all the way to the summit. When your about 150 feet below the level of the summit cut across the East face until your directly below it and ascend from there. If you continue up the NE ridge to it's peak and continue to traverse along it you will encounter class 4 and 5 climbing. That is of course only if you wish to stay on class 3.

This set shows most of the lakes in Ionian you want to visit. It has photos of the camp at the lake SE of Goddard, ascending Goddard, traversing most of the area you wish to and has photos of the route which I took down to Mcgee Lakes.

Scroll to the end of this set and it has the lake below Charybdis and climbing it also.

This set has traversing from below Charybdis across Ionian and out Goddard Creek Pass.

And if all that is not enough to make your head hurt scroll to the end of this set for photos from climbing Scylla.

"Deep breath" and lastly the beginning of this set has more traversing of Ionian.
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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby SSSdave » Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:40 am

Wandering Daisy wrote:...At the southeast end of the westernmost arm of Davis Lake you have to go over a difficult rock buttress that most likely you will have to lower packs. Then I had to cross a very steep snow finger that a fall would send you right into the lake. This year that snow finger may be gone. ...


Gee WD we share an unpleasant experience. As a young man in 1980 crossed that buttress and then the snow finger that on the old 15 minute topo shows as a permanent snow field though on the 7.5 shows the bottom snow free. Almost never gets sun so stays frozen unless air temps warm. One of the scariest snow crossings I've ever made that taught me a lesson not to ever get in such a situation again. What I did freestyle without my pack was to first use a heavy rock to pound reasonably level flat spots into the ice to walk across on that took maybe an hour. Seem to recall if I slid into the lake, because of the steep lake edge, it would be difficult to find a spot to pull out at to escape.

Next morning at Martha Lake the scare was long gone as I held up a 15 inch golden with a #16 Adams in its lip. Next day climbed Mt Goddard via the standard route and along the way explored a bit in sterile icy turf and rocky treeless fishless flowerless Ionian Basin. Came to an opinion I've held since of not being one of the many that seem to think that is such a neat place instead preferring the more life abundant elevation timberlines like down at Martha or Davis.

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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby EpicSteve » Tue May 06, 2014 3:52 am

Wow! I'd like to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread. Really great, detailed info. I'm impressed and grateful to all of you for sharing so much of your knowledge and time.

I'm quite experienced at XC and consider myself more than competent at "micro-route-finding." My days of enjoying death-defying terrain are long over and I never did like the loose stuff, but I'm good at steep talus, as long as it's not too loose. My buddy does have some limited XC experience, including some talus-hopping, but only for hours at a time, not multiple days. We will not be carrying ice axes, as he has never been shown how to self-arrest, let alone master it, so we will abort any route that requires an axe for safe passage.

For myself, I'd almost prefer to have a little less info prior to the trip, to heighten the sense of adventure. But I really want my friend to have a great time on his first big XC trip and I don't want to drag him through too much of the downside to "epic" XC journeys, so all the info is much appreciated!
“I don’t deny that there can be an element of escapism in mountaineering, but this should never overshadow its real essence, which is not escape but victory over your own human frailty.”

- Walter Bonatti
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Re: McGee Lakes - Davis Lake; Goddard Creek Pass - Beta?

Postby Rwestphal » Tue Aug 19, 2014 11:07 am

Thanks all for your replies - I am starting to think that unless we can track a route by following the series of small lakes up to davis and after crossing the small divider between the davis lakes, we may just have to stay at davis and then continue our trip by going to Wanda lake and missing out on McGee lakes. It just seems that with the past three years of drought we may just not encounter the aforementioned snow finger. According to one thread I read 1.4 miles essentially due east of mt. McGee there is a small notch that from my Tom Harrison looks like a pass between two buttresses. As for my previous experience, I have done a west to east trans- Sierra trip for the past 23 years and we always try and do at least two days of cross country. My group consists of 7 this year and we are rather experienced but we try and avoid class 3's - my father who is 74 is sick of crawling over rocks. I guess, we will have to get up early and do a day hike and see if we can locate an easy way down to McGee. We aren't going till September 1st, so by then there hopefully there is no snow. It looks looks like you can get to McGee by going well east around davis but since we are headed to Muir pass from there, the detour may be too much. As for our trip - We are going for 6 nights and won't hit the trailhead at voyager rock until about 3pm so we plan to get to post corral at 7:30. The following day we are going to hell for sure lake for the night. Next night Martha lake and then if all goes as planned to McGee lake - if not possible then davis. From there we are going to big Pete meadow after crossing Muir pass. Next day dust basin not sure if we are headed to upper or lower but it just depends on how we are faring. The finally out over bishop to south lake and of course the pizza place. I am headed to the usgs in Menlo park tomorrow to get my quadrants so hopefully I can find the way to McGee. Glad to hear there is great fishing as we are all anglers as we'll. thanks again and I will post upon return
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