R03/R04 TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21 2018
- SSSdave
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
Glad to read you two had a good time, returning safely. You were out just before our trip and the biggest storms that washed out the highway apparently hit the following day. We saw all the Piute Crags slope damage. A good concise read:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning
As someone with a good physics background that has informally studied lightning and storm phenomenon over decades, I would never be out hiking in an exposed open zone like at Piute Pass or west of the pass during thunderstorm conditions while hail or heavy rain was falling. Of course I've seen plenty of others do so, especially peak baggers, but then ignorance is bliss. Even though dangerous, a person out in such a storm in such a place is regardless unlikely to get struck because that is uncommon. But not something one ought gamble making a habit of just like some golfers that continue to play carrying their irons about courses during storms. On the other hand hiking down east from the pass once down a few hundred feet is much less dangerous because the canyon is narrow with high ridge lines that are likely to dissipate any hanging leaders before they touch the bottom of that canyon.
The reason hail and heavy rain is a time to take cover is it is an indication being in the core of taller cumulus cloud build ups above one's position. Especially at crest areas, the fact one has not heard thunder or seen flashes of nearby lightning is not a reason to feel safe because the higher ridge lines and peaks at the crest cause clouds to push higher into the atmosphere, increasing the probability of hail. Friction with hail movement down and ice crystal up in such clouds is a primary reason of charge build up. Upper areas of Humphreys Basin are some of the most dangerous places to be out on trails or walking about terrain during such storms because there are few terrain features like trees higher than a walking person. As a cloud passes overhead, there are invisible ionized leaders hanging down connected to massive positive charges at the top of clouds that are seeking a path to a negative source on the ground. If such a leader meets a person first as the first thing it touches connected to the ground, a massive cloud to ground strike may occur.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning
As someone with a good physics background that has informally studied lightning and storm phenomenon over decades, I would never be out hiking in an exposed open zone like at Piute Pass or west of the pass during thunderstorm conditions while hail or heavy rain was falling. Of course I've seen plenty of others do so, especially peak baggers, but then ignorance is bliss. Even though dangerous, a person out in such a storm in such a place is regardless unlikely to get struck because that is uncommon. But not something one ought gamble making a habit of just like some golfers that continue to play carrying their irons about courses during storms. On the other hand hiking down east from the pass once down a few hundred feet is much less dangerous because the canyon is narrow with high ridge lines that are likely to dissipate any hanging leaders before they touch the bottom of that canyon.
The reason hail and heavy rain is a time to take cover is it is an indication being in the core of taller cumulus cloud build ups above one's position. Especially at crest areas, the fact one has not heard thunder or seen flashes of nearby lightning is not a reason to feel safe because the higher ridge lines and peaks at the crest cause clouds to push higher into the atmosphere, increasing the probability of hail. Friction with hail movement down and ice crystal up in such clouds is a primary reason of charge build up. Upper areas of Humphreys Basin are some of the most dangerous places to be out on trails or walking about terrain during such storms because there are few terrain features like trees higher than a walking person. As a cloud passes overhead, there are invisible ionized leaders hanging down connected to massive positive charges at the top of clouds that are seeking a path to a negative source on the ground. If such a leader meets a person first as the first thing it touches connected to the ground, a massive cloud to ground strike may occur.
- lauralai627
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
Thanks for the sobering intel, SSSdave! I had felt somewhat safe heading over Piute Pass given the high peaks on either side but this was really just wishful thinking. While we were heading over the pass and again during the 12+ hours we spent hunkered down in the tent, we went over what we thought we knew about lightning and what we were unsure of and found we knew shockingly little! Thanks for sharing what you know!
- lauralai627
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
Yes, crazy storms! I've never been caught out in anything close to that bad but I know they can be worse - I guess I've just been lucky. I usually don't bring rain pants with me but I was so glad to have them on this trip. Thanks also for the rainbow link!Stanley Otter wrote: ↑Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:00 pm Thanks for the report. I was in the same area at the same time as you — those were some storms, huh? Glad you escaped before the slide closed the road. That really is a nice double rainbow you captured. There's an old but very good Scientific American article from 1977 about rainbows that gives some history and detailed explanations of their features if you're interested. Just sayin'...![]()
kpeter, we managed to pitch our tent in the middle of Marmotville. Each time the rain let up all of the marmots came out and perched themselves on top of the boulders scattered around and chirped for the sun to come out.
Despite the heavy afternoon rain we definitely did luck out with beautiful mornings and clear nights. It's always nice to wake up to a beautiful, clear Sierra sky (and a dry tent)!
- Stanley Otter
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
No pun intended, I'm sure.lauralai627 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 21, 2018 5:20 pm ...we went over what we thought we knew about lightning and what we were unsure of and found we knew shockingly little! ...

Roaring in my ears,
the mountain temple's silence.
Nobody else here!
-- Edith Schiffert
the mountain temple's silence.
Nobody else here!
-- Edith Schiffert
- longri
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
Nice photos, albeit a bit oversaturated. That's the current trend with digital though. I also got a big kick out of the marmot leprechaun at the end of that wonderful rainbow. Humprey's Basin and vicinity is a such a gem.
I couldn't tell from the photos or the text what made these thunderstorms unusual. There was plenty of blue sky in the images. Lightning is a definite concern at times but other than the obvious -- stay off ridges and away from lone tall trees and the like -- there's not a whole lot you can do other than remain at home. It's not impossible to be killed in your tent, just unlikely. As I recall there were folks in sheltering in their tents that were hit with ground current at Iceberg Lake near Mt. Whitney several years ago.
I couldn't tell from the photos or the text what made these thunderstorms unusual. There was plenty of blue sky in the images. Lightning is a definite concern at times but other than the obvious -- stay off ridges and away from lone tall trees and the like -- there's not a whole lot you can do other than remain at home. It's not impossible to be killed in your tent, just unlikely. As I recall there were folks in sheltering in their tents that were hit with ground current at Iceberg Lake near Mt. Whitney several years ago.
- maverick
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
It's not impossible to be killed in your tent, just unlikely.
Like this incident: http://articles.latimes.com/2005/jul/30 ... ightning30
Or inside a cabin: http://articles.latimes.com/2005/aug/04 ... /na-scout4
Same year, different state.
Professional Sierra Landscape Photographer
I don't give out specific route information, my belief is that it takes away from the whole adventure spirit of a trip, if you need every inch planned out, you'll have to get that from someone else.
Have a safer backcountry experience by using the HST ReConn Form 2.0, named after Larry Conn, a HST member: http://reconn.org
I don't give out specific route information, my belief is that it takes away from the whole adventure spirit of a trip, if you need every inch planned out, you'll have to get that from someone else.
Have a safer backcountry experience by using the HST ReConn Form 2.0, named after Larry Conn, a HST member: http://reconn.org
- SSSdave
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
In maverick's first link, it mentions the Boy Scouts set up about a meadow with the date August 11. 2005. I vaguely recall the tragedy as it made national news. By August most well drained landscapes west of the Sierra Crest tend to be well dried leaving soils near lakes, streams, and wet meadows still wet with high electrical conductivity that will be in contact with largest concentrations of negative charges in the local zone. It is those negative charges that the immense positive charges up at the thunderstorm cloud tops seek to discharge into. Any taller isolated trees in such meadows are especially probable targets to initiate a discharge and tents sticking up using the usual metal poles are moderate targets.
Although in hindsight it was unwise for scouts to tent in those areas, meadows, streams, and lakes are not usually mentioned in lightning safety literature so that is not surprising. For a person that understands the nature of conductivity in materials and the nature of thunderstorms, there is much more one can do to safely site a tent than is usually presented. What I personally seek are concave benches away from terrain knees then site on dry granite sand flats or duff (dried tree litter), areas below low height trees.
I've marked up trailside zones on the above map of the North Fork of Bishop Creek canyon east of Piute Pass. The magenta areas are more prone to lightning strikes while the orange areas are less so and unmarked areas moderate. The areas marked in magenta are along water courses, marshy seep meadows, and terrain knees. An example of a terrain knee is at the east end of Loch Leven where the canyon abruptly drops off over bedrock. Last year I camped at the orange spot along the trail at 10840+. It is the safest zone in the upper canyon as it is at the west concave end of a bench that begins at the 10789 map point that is a bedrock rib that sticks up. Above the stream on the well drained granite sand bench are sparse whitebark pines amid boulders with fair numbers of well used camp tenting sites. To the immediate north of that small orange zone, the canyon wall rises up abruptly and to its west the trail rises up through another bedrock zone before reaching the Piute Lake bench, so it is in a concavity with surrounding nearby terrain much more likely to take any lightning strikes.
In fact it is the safest place I know of in the range for experiencing exciting strong thunderstorms with lightning because thunder reverberates loudly off the surrounding rock walls of the narrow canyon. Most lightning about the canyon is far more likely to strike the canyon ridge lines so even the zones I marked in magenta are considerably less likely to draw a lightning stroke than Piute Pass or large sections of the mostly barren arctic landscapes in Humphreys Basin to the west. And the Bishop Creek areas east tends to develop more big thunderstorms than the rest of Owens Valley as valley areas north rise up thus shunting monsoon flows.
Although in hindsight it was unwise for scouts to tent in those areas, meadows, streams, and lakes are not usually mentioned in lightning safety literature so that is not surprising. For a person that understands the nature of conductivity in materials and the nature of thunderstorms, there is much more one can do to safely site a tent than is usually presented. What I personally seek are concave benches away from terrain knees then site on dry granite sand flats or duff (dried tree litter), areas below low height trees.
I've marked up trailside zones on the above map of the North Fork of Bishop Creek canyon east of Piute Pass. The magenta areas are more prone to lightning strikes while the orange areas are less so and unmarked areas moderate. The areas marked in magenta are along water courses, marshy seep meadows, and terrain knees. An example of a terrain knee is at the east end of Loch Leven where the canyon abruptly drops off over bedrock. Last year I camped at the orange spot along the trail at 10840+. It is the safest zone in the upper canyon as it is at the west concave end of a bench that begins at the 10789 map point that is a bedrock rib that sticks up. Above the stream on the well drained granite sand bench are sparse whitebark pines amid boulders with fair numbers of well used camp tenting sites. To the immediate north of that small orange zone, the canyon wall rises up abruptly and to its west the trail rises up through another bedrock zone before reaching the Piute Lake bench, so it is in a concavity with surrounding nearby terrain much more likely to take any lightning strikes.
In fact it is the safest place I know of in the range for experiencing exciting strong thunderstorms with lightning because thunder reverberates loudly off the surrounding rock walls of the narrow canyon. Most lightning about the canyon is far more likely to strike the canyon ridge lines so even the zones I marked in magenta are considerably less likely to draw a lightning stroke than Piute Pass or large sections of the mostly barren arctic landscapes in Humphreys Basin to the west. And the Bishop Creek areas east tends to develop more big thunderstorms than the rest of Owens Valley as valley areas north rise up thus shunting monsoon flows.
- dougieb
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
Humphreys was one of my first off trail explorations and it was fun, relatively easy travel doing a loop to the different lakes. I've since been back several times on different trips, including a loop around the glacial divide, leaving over Lamarck Col and going counter clockwise. I'll never forget the first time though. We had heavy lightning 4 days in a row and had those moments like you mentioned where we looked at each other and cringed.
- giantbrookie
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
Terrific trip, in spite of the storms. The rainbow photos are special and rare.
As many trips I've done, of course I've had my share of terrifying moments in thunderstorms, including many when the time delay was fractions of a second (ie it seemed as if the flash and bang were simultaneous) and I had one climb when my ice axe started to buzz. In terms of a bad camping spot I recall one below Shepherd Pass (E side). We were coming from the Upper Kern with a very long detour into Williamson Basin and we had been blasted on and off since late morning by periodic thunderstorms. We were running out of daylight when I camped on a nice shelf among some scrubby pines, the first really nice camping spot E of the pass. Judy was exhausted and went to sleep as soon as I pitched the tent. I stayed out a bit and just before I too knocked off (and before the light faded so that I couldn't see), I noticed how many of those little pines near are tent had apparently been struck in past thunderstorms. I figured the storms were past for the evening and I was really tired, so I crawled in and knocked off. I thought to myself "I'm glad Judy didn't see this or she wouldn't be able to sleep".I slept so well, I had no idea that a particularly fierce thunderstorm came over us, and Judy couldn't sleep at all as the tent shook with many rumbles that seemed to come at the same time as the flash. I look around at the state of trees and such around where I pitch nowadays in addition to the terrain reading thing. SSS Dave Neat map of the N. Fork Bishop Creek with relative hazard zones. Judy and I camped on one of the orange strips on the N side of Piute Lake in the biggest rain and thunderstorm I've ever been through in the Sierra back in 2001.
As many trips I've done, of course I've had my share of terrifying moments in thunderstorms, including many when the time delay was fractions of a second (ie it seemed as if the flash and bang were simultaneous) and I had one climb when my ice axe started to buzz. In terms of a bad camping spot I recall one below Shepherd Pass (E side). We were coming from the Upper Kern with a very long detour into Williamson Basin and we had been blasted on and off since late morning by periodic thunderstorms. We were running out of daylight when I camped on a nice shelf among some scrubby pines, the first really nice camping spot E of the pass. Judy was exhausted and went to sleep as soon as I pitched the tent. I stayed out a bit and just before I too knocked off (and before the light faded so that I couldn't see), I noticed how many of those little pines near are tent had apparently been struck in past thunderstorms. I figured the storms were past for the evening and I was really tired, so I crawled in and knocked off. I thought to myself "I'm glad Judy didn't see this or she wouldn't be able to sleep".I slept so well, I had no idea that a particularly fierce thunderstorm came over us, and Judy couldn't sleep at all as the tent shook with many rumbles that seemed to come at the same time as the flash. I look around at the state of trees and such around where I pitch nowadays in addition to the terrain reading thing. SSS Dave Neat map of the N. Fork Bishop Creek with relative hazard zones. Judy and I camped on one of the orange strips on the N side of Piute Lake in the biggest rain and thunderstorm I've ever been through in the Sierra back in 2001.
Since my fishing (etc.) website is still down, you can be distracted by geology stuff at: http://www.fresnostate.edu/csm/ees/facu ... ayshi.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- robertseeburger
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Re: TR: Humphrey’s Basin Storms 7/19-21
Stories about thunderstorms....my favorite is about 40 years ago. I was camped at Mott Lake and decided to climb Mt. Izaak Walton. A storm formed very fast. I thought I was being careful, but I guess I wasn't. A lightning bolt hit BELOW me and the thunder was instantaneous. Scared the hell out of me. All I could do was ....get down fast. I probably set a record for down climbing and I had to go through where the bolt hit. This event has affected my thought process for the last 40 years. In fact even in my most recent post, I referenced not climbing Mt. Brewer and not going over Milestone Pass .. trying to be conservative.
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