High Sierra Topix

Thank you for the leg work Dave. You are right, they could quickly go over any regs one would need to know over the phone and inform the leader that they are responsible for any infractions by their group.

Dave:

Good work on all of that. I agree there ought to be some sort of exception based on either experience or maybe on online Q&A test with each permit. It's not necessary that each member of the party take it, only the person getting the permit since that's the person who's responsible for the whole group (that's who gets the ticket for any violations...). I'll add that to my season end report -- I forgot to do it last year when I had a number of complaints about this issue.

As noted, I'm sympathetic, but I'll also add that when I run into people who are running amok, 80% of them come in from the Inyo. The NPS permit issuers do a great job and it's rare that people who are talked to directly do something wrong. That's why the policy was changed. We see the same thing with PCT hikers in the early season. They are responsible for a disproportionate share of violations, probably because they just get their through-hiking permit and not regulations specific to Sequoia Kings (or Yosemite). Plus, I hesitate to mention it, a certain arrogance along the lines of "I'm hiking the PCT and get to do whatever I want..."

Anyway, keep us updated on this. If I can help, I will.

George

Dave,
Thanks for all of the work. I had another idea. It might require a little more manhours for the park service, but maybe not. Here it goes:
Along the same lines as an 'online' course for compliance, every hunter in the state has to go through a hunter safety course. Few hours, brief test and then annually registers and pays for a permit to hunt that year. Why not have a backpackers permit? Take a course from a local sporting goods store, nps station, ranger station or like venue and receive a certification. It wouldn't be a long class. Every year you get another license (permit), at that time you have to show proof of completion of the course via old license or course certificate and when paying for new permit receive updated regs. Slightly more of an honor system, but as you've all mentioned, there will always be those that screw it up for the rest of us. Now, before a trip, you call in your itenerary, give your license (permit) number and pick up your permit whenever you wish. There are I don't know how many more hunters in this state than backpackers, that system should work without much undue cost or burden. Your thoughts...
Tory

Interesting idea, but licensing backpackers, that would create a whole new set of problems. Think of the poaching problem in hunting. It is also another set of paperwork to be tracked and costly to maintain. There has been a big discussion on user fees within the past year and a license fee would be seen as a backdoor of bringing in that fee.

Going with the idea of a training course just add a number to the training certificate. If you have a cert and number you can pick up the WP via a night box or mail. If you don't have the cert you go in person and listen to the rules.

I do not pack in National Park wilderness because my hiking companions are hairy and walk on all fours but I support everything you are doing, Dave. Most of my backpacking is from non-quota trailheads with self-service permits and I have had good fortune lately with my "quota" trips but it has not always been that way. I get the feeling that policy changes that have an effect on us backpackers are done without any input from backpackers. It should be clear to those in charge that no written or face to face list of rules is going to make a bit of difference when there is no one out there to enforce those rules but this is the government we are talking about. Please let me know if there is anything that I can do to help.