High Sierra Topix

Big possibility as to why there are fewer bear issues north of Tahoe: they get shot at up there.

paul wrote:Big possibility as to why there are fewer bear issues north of Tahoe: they get shot at up there.

Very possible, I have deer hunted a lot in the mountains around Greenhorn above lake Isabella and there are many bears in the area. I'm sure it has happened at some time but Ive never seen a bear come near a camp or camp ground looking for food. I've seen them near camps many tmes but they were just passing by and never a problem. The bears make a point to stay as clear of humans as much as possible or they don't live long enough to be a nuisance. No one worries about bears raiding ice chests or food boxes even when left outside at night. Because of the bears great fear of humans and there intelligence there population continues to grow despite heavy hunting pressure.

I've always thought that it would be worth a try for the FS to start shooting bears in areas like Yosemite with paintball guns as long as they changed the kind of ammo they used. I say shoot them every chance they get with paint balls filled with pepper spray instead of paint. At the same time they could place booby traped ice chests, backpacks, bear lockers, and just about anything else with bear spray. Of course the baited pepper traps would have to be marked or protected somehow from the public. My point is that because of a bears intelligence I don't think it would take much for them to get wise to the smell of pepper spray. After that all you would have to do is wipe the smallest amount of pepper juice on the bottom of your pack tent or even ice chest and I don't think that a bear would come within a 100yds of your camp.

paul wrote:Big possibility as to why there are fewer bear issues north of Tahoe: they get shot at up there.

I doubt that. They get shot in Sierra NF, and they are problems there. Not as much of a problem as in Yose, due to less traffic in general, tho. I suspect the real correlation is with high numbers of backpackers and hikers in the area.

I've always thought that it would be worth a try for the FS to start shooting bears in areas like Yosemite with paintball guns as long as they changed the kind of ammo they used. I say shoot them every chance they get with paint balls filled with pepper spray instead of paint. At the same time they could place booby traped ice chests, backpacks, bear lockers, and just about anything else with bear spray. Of course the baited pepper traps would have to be marked or protected somehow from the public. My point is that because of a bears intelligence I don't think it would take much for them to get wise to the smell of pepper spray. After that all you would have to do is wipe the smallest amount of pepper juice on the bottom of your pack tent or even ice chest and I don't think that a bear would come within a 100yds of your camp.

Pepper spray doesn't work that way. It needs to go into the mucous membrane of the target animal, not the coat of the animal. It only works if you spray it in the eyes/nose. You can't booby trap anything with it and expect to get a reliable dose administered where it needs to go.

As someone who's had pepper spray I can tell you it does nothing when it's on your skin. It's when you forget you handled the nozzle, rub your eye, and get a tiny bit of it in the corner that you realize it's there.

I love it. Everyone has a "folk" remedy for preventing bears from getting food. It's as if they are the first to come up with the idea. I hate to admit that he might be right but listen to George, gdurkee to newbies on the forum. George is about as old as the Grizzley Giant and has spent years in the BC in Yosemite and SEKI and has heard of every technique known to man (and woman). If a technique other than making food totally inaccessible to a bear (lockers and canisters) has worked for you it is for one of two reasons--a bear never happened by or the bear for some reason just wasn't interested (once we inadvertently left food out in a remote backcountry location and later that night I watched a bear walk past our "kitchen area" without even sniffing around. If I were to base my technique on this experience I guess we wouldn't ever have to worry about bears.

Three rules for people on this forum if they don't want bears to get their food.
1. Use a canister.
2. Pay attention to what George has to say.
3. Remember 1 and 2

mike

George is about as old as the Grizzley Giant

I am a young and vigorous pup! Though with knees that sound like a squeeky chew toy... .

Woof.

"About 350 thru hikers cross the Sierra on the PCT every year. All the hikers I met at KM had a bear canister but I heard tell that some did not simply beacuse they were already carrying 10 days of food and the extra 3 lbs seemed prohibitive to them.( I know they are being selfish bastards.. as I said I did carry a canister myself) Wouldn't we rather they use something to safeguard the bears from their food?
You can make more money, but you can't make more time."

Hetchy
Topix Regular

Posts: 241
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2009 7:51 pm
Location: Santa Cruz Mountains Summit Rd and San Jose Soquel


I don't remember ever meating a backpacker in the backcountry who I thought was behaving like a (selfish) bastard. I met some who I thought sould behave differently, but selfish bastard? No. Tom.

It's not only selfish, it's breaking the law.

rlown wrote:It's not only selfish, it's breaking the law.

There are people who never have a bear mess with their canister and think it's a waste of time... it's like speeding. Sometimes you get caught, sometimes you don't, but you're gambling - instead of just risking a fine, you are risking a fine AND the life of a bear that should not be learning how to get people's food from you. It's not the bear's fault you have to be there for him to forage from. You're the thinking being and the visitor - be responsible, be sure the bear can't get it.

I usually just tell folks going on overnight folks with me in the Sierra that they are carrying a canister, and if they can demonstrate a proper counterbalance at the trailhead, they can leave it in the car for hikes into areas where cans aren't mandated, otherwise take the $%^^&## can, suck it up, save a bear and your sanity - don't leave the can behind if you're prone to getting out there, getting tired and sweaty, and giving up too easily on finding a good branch for a good hang.

If it's an alpine outing, we take cans.

Ok, I know this is a bit off topic, but I’ll bring it up anyway. In areas that canisters are required, of course I use one. Usually in other areas I hang. I have found counter balance be very difficult to implement. The past few trips I have been using the so called PCT method. What do you all think about the effectiveness of PCT versus counterbalance?