High Sierra Topix

Yes--the permit system in Yosemite is done through the Yosemite Conservancy Wilderness Office. I spoke to a live person who answered the phone, found my reservation in their computer system, and said "thank you."

Doesn't sound like Reserve America!

I don't know about Reserve America but I've called recreation.gov more than once and received courteous help. They manage a lot of different places so their knowledge isn't as intimate as someone working for Yosemite Conservancy.

On the other hand, the last time I tried to call Yosemite for permit information I had to hit the redial on my phone every few seconds for about 20 minutes. The person I spoke to was nice enough, although there was a sense of needing to hurry in his voice. Last year I sent a FAX in every day for two and half weeks before I got a permit. So it isn't all roses there either.

I checked the credit card statement and discovered that they never charged me a cancellation fee for last October, just the fee for the new permit.

I have mixed views on Yosemite going to Recreation.gov. It is easy and convenient and so if you are able to plan far enough in advance on your date(s) it works fine. However, the number of people who make reservations and never show up seems to be pretty high from our observation of the campgrounds at Point Reyes. There seems to be at least 25% no-show rate every time we've gone (over the last three years this is a dozen times) and sometimes it's more like 50%. And we only go when the weather is decent so that cannot be the reason for not showing up. My worry for Yosemite would be the popular trailheads will be booked far in advance even sooner than it is now. The one good thing is I suspect a morning day-of walk-up permit will become easier to get if you are one or two people.

SSS Dave- you can get an annual pass for Desolation for $20. Then all you have to do is get a permit at one of the offices. I imagine you could also reserve on the internet and give your pass number. The annual pass is for one complete year. I have June left on my last year's, so will probably use it soon. If you go more than twice, it is a good deal.

LMBSGV wrote:I checked the credit card statement and discovered that they never charged me a cancellation fee for last October, just the fee for the new permit.

Rec.gov, etc - they don't charge for cancellation. They just deduct the reservation fee and a portion off of your refunded reservation amount. It usually is $15/reservation that is not refunded. If this did not happen to you, well, consider yourself lucky.

I cancelled permits for North Fork Big Pine a couple of weeks ago when another obligation kept me from my plans. I know weekend permits for that TH are hard to come by, so I wanted to make sure that they were back in the pool. The process was easy on recreation.gov.

I think the whole trailhead quota system needs a revision. If I go in a trailhead, walk on the trail for 2 miles, then basically go off trail the rest of the trip, that is a different impact than someone staying on the trails. Just managing the number going in each day seems a pretty crude system. I would also like to see some of the less used trailheads returned to no-quota trails. More information on less used trails would also be helpful. When the forest or park web sites give information on only the few most used trails, that just adds to the crowding.

I preferred it when first-come permits were at least 50% of the permits. When you have 60% or more as reserved spots, and there are 25-50% no-shows, this indicates that the reservation system is not working properly.

I wonder what would happen if they simply did a test year or two with no quotas and no permits.

Wandering Daisy wrote:I think the whole trailhead quota system needs a revision.

Be careful what you wish for. The future for us may be a system where you have to reserve a specific camping zone for each night. That seems to be the standard in other national parks.

Wandering Daisy wrote:I wonder what would happen if they simply did a test year or two with no quotas and no permits.

My guess is that many less visited places would remain about the same but the super popular, over impacted areas would be even more crowded.

I think the whole trailhead quota system needs a revision.

Agreed, but ain't gonna happen in the near future.

After a recent conversation with the Wilderness Managers from Yosemite NP, Stanislaus NF, and Inyo NF about this issue, there seems to be a sense of frustration and no real agreement on how things should or will proceed. A major sticking point is that most of the agencies have their own issuing guide lines for wilderness permits, and getting them up to date, or on the same page seems like an insurmountable task, or at least one that will take a long time.

Do not believe that any agency will want to give up the control of the land that falls under their jurisdiction willingly, whether it makes sense or not, quotas give them some sense of control. Inyo is considering quotas on Donohue Pass for north bound hikers, which may make things even more difficult on folks using this section of the JMT/PCT.

Be careful what you wish for. The future for us may be a system where you have to reserve a specific camping zone for each night. That seems to be the standard in other national parks.

I just experienced this in Zion. Did a walk up permit when the office opened (I was 8th in line) and had to reserve a specific camp site for each night (there were 8 total sites in the area we were going). There was only 1 choice left for each night we were going in (the rest had been reserved). We headed in on a Tuesday for site #4 and came across three other sites that were vacant. We could see site #5 from site #4 and nobody ever showed up at site #5. Actually, during all our hiking around and coming across 4 other sites we didn't see a single soul all week (except the day hiker as we were on our way out). So, 7 out of 8 sites had been booked and tied up all week and not a single person turned up for any of them during any of the 5 nights we were out there. It was just us out there by our lonesome. We had the wilderness to ourselves. It was pretty awesome for us, but probably a bummer for anybody else who tried to do a walk up permit.