Anyone battle fear on the trail?

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kpeter
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by kpeter »

No fear of backpacking. No fear of being alone in a wilderness. No fear 99% of the time. But definitely fear in certain situations.

I have mild fear at tricky river crossings. I have felt genuine fear the few times I've been caught hiking in an exposed place when a really vigorous thunderstorm starts. (But fascination at the same time.) I have a mild but annoying fear of exposed heights. When a trail takes me near a lot of exposure I do feel twinges--even, for example, Bishop Pass. But it is not debilitating.

Years ago I witnessed several bear attacks on hung food and did feel fear as we yelled and flashed lights in the dark. That was in the pre-bear canister era. Watching a large bear standing on its hind legs reaching for food while grunting and making angry sounds did make me fearful.

As I think about it, most of the time I am in the wilderness I experience tranquility, but the knowledge that fear could be around the corner does give the experience some spice.
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Jimr
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by Jimr »

Papasequoia made a very valid point. There are two types of fear: Reasonable fear and bare fear. Reasonable fear is a feeling based on the thought that there is a high probability of danger and is predicated on the idea that a dangerous situation is, or is about to occur. Bare fear is based on nothing but our brain playing "what if" games with us. It is not your friend.

A woman is walking down a street at night and notices a man walking toward her. Her head says "oh my god, what if this man attacks me?" Bare fear.

Her head says "oh my god, this man is about to attack me" Reasonable fear. Something in the situation alerted her ( probably an unconscious cue) that something was not right and danger was a high probability.

Many responses have pointed to feelings of reasonable fear appropriate to the situation, but lacking bare fear (dread).

Personally, I can't recall any time I've experienced fear while backpacking. Concern, yes.

I take that back. This year, while bivying on trail on a steep slope, I did experience some fear with sounds of animals walking in the forest duff in pitch black. After several attempts to locate the source of the sound with my flashlight and once, getting out of bed to search around, I let it go. A big cat or any size bear was the primary concern.

Also, a bit of fear on this same trip when my kid walked away from camp in an upset state of mind.
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Flux
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by Flux »

I live with my anxiety every day. It showed up a couple years back and continues to rear it's ugly head. The pressures and stresses of my life coupled with my vivid imagination pushed me into this genetically predisposed fearfulness. I deal with it constantly. My body can literally react to an imaginary thought of a threat as though it were real.

My biggest fear in the backcountry is that my cardio self will not handle the exertion. This is simply my anxiety. I've been checked out by a cardiologist, carried heavy packs over high passes, grunted up steep slopes and I am still here. I've maxed my heart rate peak bagging and had to sit for a while and calm it down. In short, I have passed the ultimate stress tests but still worry about it. What I try to do is adjust my pace, watch my breathing, and stay steady. It's an irrational fear, but one that sticks with me. I get anxious before a big hike and usually the first few miles until I get through a few heavy breathing sessions and see that I'm fine. Again, totally irrational, and a "bare fear".
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by Wandering Daisy »

Jimr- I think you are over-simplifying things. Each person has their own "breakover point" concerning what probability is sufficient to cause fear. Few people sit there and calculate probabilities. Fear is a feeling - needs to be validated, before you can deal with it. When I am sacred and someone tells me I am "over-reacting" or my fear is not justified, I just want to punch them in the face.

A lot of fear has to do with your past experiences, gut level intuition, and how vulnerable you feel. The elderly become quite fearful simply becasue they realize they no longer have the quick reaction, strength or mental capacity to deal with once they dealt with and that even minor injuries can baloon into life and death injuries. Many 2 year olds have no fear at all (that is why parenting a toddler is so challenging!). What we fear, why we fear and when we fear change throughout our lives. In our society, boys have traditionally been raised to supress fear (and feelings in general), whereas girls have traditionally been raised to avoid fear. However, I would guess more men fear social situations than women.

There is a wide gray area between what each person perceives as reasonable fear and bare fear. I do not feel it is my place to judge what is "reasonable" for someone else. That said, if someone recognizes their fear and wants me to help them learn to deal with it, I certainly would offer advise.

Past experiences matter. If the woman walking down the street has been raped in the past by a man walking past her, she has reasonable fear that the current stranger walking towards her is danger. I was driving and broad-sided by another car while I was making a left turn. It took me three years to get over it- I still hate left turns. A good number of my friends have died mountaineering. At one point, the fear just got to me and I quit technical climbing and began to do more backpacking. The few times I have returned to climbing, I no longer enjoyed it as much. It is possible that in the future, a string of poor experiences backpacking could result in my quitting. I am a long way from that right now, but not so cocky as to think it could not happen. More likely I would simply avoid those specific situations that caused the bad outcome (such as solo in grizzly bear habitat).

I am not a thrill seeker - I backpack for enjoyment and peace of mind and challenge (but not "thrill"). There are people who like feeling fear (adreneline junkies); I am not one.

There are inherent risks in backpacking. I have put a great deal of effort into reducing risks and it has resulted in reduction of fear. This is probably the main reason I am never going to be an XUL backpacker-the safety issues far outweight the discomfort issues for me.

Back to the original post - good for you for working through your fear issues.
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by Flux »

Hikingfamily:

Do you know that your fears are a form of PTSD??

Not sure if they will ever really go away fully, but you have to train your mind and use each and every good experience as a way to break the pattern.
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by Jimr »

It is an objective look at fear from a categorical perspective, not a judgment about another persons feelings. Feelings are always valid. Their source is worth evaluating, especially if there is a crippling affect on one's life experience. It doesn't take a course in statistics or logic to do it. Reasonable is not my judgment as to whether or not another person should fear (should is a judgment, btw), it is in response to the question "is the fear I'm feeling pertinent to the situation at hand." I'll put it in an equally contentious manner:

Reasonable fear = feeling = always valid
Bare fear = emotion = never valid

(reasonable and valid are synonymous here)

What's the difference? To me, a great deal. Feelings are what is real and in the now. Emotions are feelings + a story about those feelings and are not in the now. Most likely a story that involves anybody or anything that brought the feeling up in the past; a script that runs in our heads. While the feeling is real, the story tends to amplify the feeling into something that is no longer relevant to the situation at hand. It is the stories of the past that blows the feeling out of proportion as well as the reaction to it.

Everybody has a mix of feelings and emotions. We all act from time to time based on emotions that just don't seem to fit the situation. Some more, some less. Some to the point that they are crippling in some or all aspects of life, PTSD.

Ever get handed a new A@@hole for accidentally cutting somebody off in traffic? You didn't get reamed for what you did, you got reamed for everybody that ever cut that person off. You just powerlessly read their script.
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by rlown »

hmm.. Wikipedia seems to cover all the aspects so far mentioned under "Anxiety."
Anxiety
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
For other uses, see Anxiety (disambiguation).
Anxiety

Anxiety (also called angst or worry) is a psychological and physiological state characterized by somatic, emotional, cognitive, and behavioral components.[2] It is the displeasing feeling of fear and concern.[3] The root meaning of the word anxiety is 'to vex or trouble'; in either presence or absence of psychological stress, anxiety can create feelings of fear, worry, uneasiness, and dread.[4] However, anxiety should not be confused with fear, it is more of a dreaded feeling about something which appears intimidating and can overcome an individual.[5] Anxiety is considered to be a normal reaction to a stressor. It may help an individual to deal with a demanding situation by prompting them to cope with it. However, when anxiety becomes overwhelming, it may fall under the classification of an anxiety disorder.[6]
at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anxiety" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Still, seeing the trailhead sign relaxes me as long as I've planned well with contingency plans.
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sparky
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by sparky »

I think hope and anxiety are two ends with a wide spectrum in between, but sit as opposites. There is a certain element of fear that is what I would consider wisdom.

We all live a subjective life, and what things mean to me don't mean anything to anyone else, and vice versa. There is no right or wrong when it comes to what emotions are necessary. It is absolutely impossible for any of us to not be exactly the way we are supposed to be, to react the way we are supposed to react. I will try to remember that the next time my lady freaks out over what I think is "nothing" :lol:
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by East Side Hiker »

There's really "not much" to fear in the Sierra. John Muir called it the "Gentle Wilderness." Bears are not a problem unless you provoke them. The landscape is not a problem if you don't push it and stay on the trail (with your children). Using common sense will prevent problems with the landscape. If there's snow, wait and follow a large group of people.

Pick routes that are popular, so the bears are scattered and the landscape (trail) has been trampled. But in these cases, you need to get a permit very early. With a lot of people around, your fears will diminish. Try trails out of Mammoth, June Lake, Saddlebag Lake, Carson Pass...

But don't fear the trail, just be cautious and calculating. And get those permits early.
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Re: Anyone battle fear on the trail?

Post by oldranger »

I kind of laughed at the thought at first of being afraid on the trail then I reflected on my experiences this year.

1. Several days hiking in Glacier and Waterton Lakes. Kathy and I carried bear spray canisters, made a lot of noise and never saw a Grizz on the trail. But our anxiety level was pretty high.

2. I camped alone at Domke Lake near lake Chelan in the Washington Cascades. Just as I finished peeing in the middle of the night and was returning to my tent I heard a sound that seemed like a cross between a sick cow mooing and and elk bugling . I knew that a moose had been spotted in the area recently and the sound continued for at least 5 minutes after I returned to the tent. All I could imagine was getting trampled to death by an enraged moose while trapped in my tent. But soon I fell asleep and remarkably I woke up the next morning still alive.

Oh check out Snow Nymphs signature. Says it all and she has had a more terrifying experience than I would wish on anyone.

Mike
Mike

Who can't do everything he used to and what he can do takes a hell of a lot longer!
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