Locked ammo box for bear cannister?

[WarrenFork]

The list of areas where they are required in Inyo NF is found on this page of the forest website. If you can't access it with your device right now, these are the general areas:

• Bishop Pass Area
  Cottonwood Lakes Basin/Cottonwood Pass Area
  Duck Pass/Purple Lakes Area
  Fish Creek Area
  Kearsarge Pass Area
  Little Lakes Valley Area
  Mammoth Lakes/Rush Creek Area
  Mount Whitney Area

There are individual maps linked to the above page that show the extent of each area with a requirement. Bishop Pass is the closest to where you are going but Piute Pass and Humphreys Basin are outside its boundaries.

[zacjust32]

I was just thinking a 400 pound bear pouncing with its front end would destroy most plastic buckets in a single blow. Jaw gape aside. I think I will get at the info center again tomorrow. I'll probably end up up getting the stupid overpriced buckets.

There's actually a lot of engineering, stress analysis, and material selection that goes into something like that. Not only is a cylinder one of the strongest shapes -it's how submarines are built- but it also helps prevent the bear from picking it up. An ammo can has neither of those properties. I can see the bear crushing the side and then peeling the top off like a can of tuna. An ammo can is great for other uses -peak registers- but it's not an ideal choice for a bearproof canister in my opinion. Plus, a real canister is lighter.

[Tom_H]

I think there are two issues. The first is that the bear can get a bite on it and (particularly a Grizzly) crush it. The second is that ammo cans are relatively heavy. I used to use them for gear when canoe camping though back before dry bags came along. They kept stuff dry and tied in to the thwarts very securely.

[dooder]

Your right about the cylinder shape being strong. I think on one of the government sites is where I read the smell containment/ air tight issue is important. It said to put anything with a scent like soap inside the containers. I will just get both and bring them as needed depending on where I'm going. As far as weight its not really an issue for me the worst death hike I've ever been on was like a 60 or 70 pound pack in 115 degree heat by Palm Springs 4th of July no problem for me. I ended up carrying my bigger weaker friends stuff for them. I'm glad people didn't think I'm just trying to make up my own rules. I misread a weird article about modified approved cannisters. If you Google "ammo cans for bear box" the PDF should be there. I'm going to follow the rules, I was just driving at all bear canisters started as homemade prototypes in all likelihood. Ive been building houses and fixing them for over ten years. A bear cannister is elementary stuff. First and foremost im just going to follow the rules as they apply and bring the legal bear cannister where its needed. Thanks again for all the quick replies people! It gives me time to get it in the mail before I leave in case we have to go somewhere besides piute pass. Jayson

[longri]

Yeah, no shit. There's no way a steel box is going to weigh less than a carbon fiber cylinder. The only reason to carry an ammo box, other that you have an abnormally flat back, is that you just plain like ammo boxes. They're military and American and stuff.

I'd rather carry a plain nylon sack. Or if bears or mice are an issue, a kevlar one. But land managers recognize that the average backpacker intelligence is less than the average ursine one. So the ultra-stong rigid, approved bear canister is the rule. Suck it up!

[rayfound]

If you're doing the trip over Piute Pass from North Lake that you describe in your other thread, there is no bear cannister requirement in force in that area. So you could use whatever food storage method you wish without worrying about a fine.

I've been going into Humphreys Basin for 40 years and I've never seen a bear there.

I've also never seen a Bear there.

And technically, yes, bear cans are not required - however: in most of the areas, there simply are not any trees to do other bear-safe food storage. So a bearcan is really the only option.

Also, Bearcans are not remotely odor-proof or airtight. The BearVaults for sure are not. The reason anything with scent goes in is that you don't want a bear tearing up a backpack to get a cherry-chapstick or your toothpaste - it isn't about keeping them from smelling things, it is about keeping them from getting what they smell.

[longri]

Also, Bearcans are not remotely odor-proof or airtight.

Bearikades, when new at least, have an air tight seal.

Odor proof is a different problem since the outside of the canister probably has a residual food odor. And anyway, bears probably know by sight what a bear canister is and what it might contain.

[WarrenFork]

But land managers recognize that the average backpacker intelligence is less than the average ursine one.

And as far as the NPS goes, most of the local ones I know also recognize that the average intelligence of the policy-making bureaucrats at Pacific West Regional on Bush St in San Francisco is pretty far south of both.

[rayfound]

Bearikades, when new at least, have an air tight seal.
.

OK, sure - you cut off my comment about Bearvault NOT being air tight. The Bearikade may be - but my point was simply that air/odor tight is not the primary goal of a bearcan.

[longri]

Bearikades, when new at least, have an air tight seal.
.

OK, sure - you cut off my comment about Bearvault NOT being air tight. The Bearikade may be - but my point was simply that air/odor tight is not the primary goal of a bearcan.

Sorry, I really didn't mean to misquote you or misconstrue what you posted. I was just trying to add some information.

For posterity:

Also, Bearcans are not remotely odor-proof or airtight. The BearVaults for sure are not. The reason anything with scent goes in is that you don't want a bear tearing up a backpack to get a cherry-chapstick or your toothpaste - it isn't about keeping them from smelling things, it is about keeping them from getting what they smell.