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Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

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Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby maverick » Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:24 pm

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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby RichardCullip » Mon Jun 03, 2013 5:52 pm

Very sad indeed.
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby rlown » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:16 pm

why is it sad?
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby maverick » Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:07 pm

Because it could have been avoided by an educated, in the dangers of water
safety, group leader who would/should have been watching out for this teenager.
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby rlown » Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:08 pm

why is that not obvious? don't swim near a fall.

didn't mean to be callous, but still. just don't.. can't blame this on those watching over them. other than don't go in the water here.
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby 87TT » Tue Jun 04, 2013 7:06 am

rlown wrote:why is that not obvious? don't swim near a fall.

didn't mean to be callous, but still. just don't.. can't blame this on those watching over them. other than don't go in the water here.

Agree, dumb not sad. Seems like we run around trying to protect kids now instead of teaching them how to look out for danger. Like teaching them how to cross a street. Basic, don't swim in a river above a waterfall. :-k
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby AlmostThere » Tue Jun 04, 2013 7:29 am

People die in the Kings all the time, towing each other with Home Depot ropes meant not for dragging five or more people through current but for lashing firewood together.... falling out of boats drunk, getting stuck in weirs or strainers or in rocks. I think water is easy to take for granted, particularly when you see people successfully come back out of it. You don't think you'll be the one who "gets it" and then suddenly the current is stronger than you thought it would be....

There was a video we were shown in a water awareness training taken by a phone in the hands of a tourist - kid was climbing a boulder next to the Merced, fell into a pool formed by an eddy next to the rock. Fell again, and again, with much laughing and giggling and splashing. Fourth time, the kid fell a few inches too far, over the "fence" into the current, and the phone gets dropped - the next picture was a rescuer on the end of an extension ladder with many ropes rigged pulling the body out of the middle of the river where it had been lodged in some rocks by the current.

The number of falls related deaths in past years makes me think having a kiosk with such a video might make more difference to people than a sign they can ignore. As we all know experience, even a shared one, has more impact than words...

I have a lot of sympathy for people who do these things out of ignorance - they never got a chance to learn they need to believe signs. I think we have so many signs and waivers and warnings due to our hyped up concerns about litigation that people tune out the ones that really matter.
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby Wandering Daisy » Tue Jun 04, 2013 10:50 am

This is another member of a "church group". I think it is about time that someone convinces church groups to have some training and information sessions before they take members into the wilderness. Is it the fatalistic thinking "it is Gods will" or is it unqualified leaders? Or is it that "youth groups" are the problem? Boy scouts are youth groups and they do not seem to regularly die being washed over falls in Yosemite. My impression is that boy scout leaders get more training than church group leaders. Yes, it is very sad because it was preventable. No matter what the stupidity, the young man has a mother and father and perhaps siblings who now have to deal with the incredible loss.
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby rlown » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:02 am

how is it preventable.? he made a choice. a really bad choice. Bat him on the head with a bible before he jumped in?

I really don't need a sign to tell me this is a bad idea. And yet, some think "hey, this looks fun" Had a teen jump off the GG bridge recently, for fun. lived. broke a tailbone. surfer saved him.

More to your point, WD. if the mother/father instilled safety into the guy, maybe he would be alive.

Just don't do dumb.
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby SSSdave » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:21 am

Some pure speculations trying to get into the mind of why young people swim in these dangerous areas above Nevada and Vernal falls. The 19 year old of course read the warning signs so understood there was danger. He may have suggested taking a swim while grinning challengingly looking at the other teens in his group and I'd bet some indicated not too duck the railings. But as part of a group with other young teens, he was probably engaged in showing off to others how he could challenge danger and some likely giggled as he first crossed over to the rock island.

In days since the fatal swim, none of the church group has said anything to the media likely because as a group they decided not to do so as the truth is probably embarassing. Also likely reflects on ignorance of general mountain dangers within leadership of that group. Of course many such visitors and groups come to Yosemite without any previous experience in our mountains and though leaders may keep a short leash on 15 year olds, probably if any were watching the 19 year old considered him old enough to do as he wished without embarassing the person in front of others.
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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby AlmostThere » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:40 am

I very much doubt there are very many mothers or fathers who never go into the wilderness , who could possibly know how to instill safety in their kids when it comes to waterfalls and rivers .

My own parents , who made a habit of going into the mountains at every opportunity , never really talked much about safety . Of course they never let us go on the water in the first place .



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Re: Another Nevada Falls Tragedy

Postby maverick » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:56 am

A group leader is responsible for the safety and well being of its members,
especially teenagers or younger kids. With 3 deaths at Vernal Falls in 2011, 1
in 2012, and 1 at Vernal and 1 at Nevada Falls so far this year, the dangers of
fast moving rivers has been well publicized for years now.
The NP has signs where this teenager entered into the water indicating
the dangers of the strong current which many of us here have seen while
passing through this area. There are many questions like: Was the trip
leader experienced and educated in the dangers of the wilderness and this
area in particular? Did the leader have a talk before heading up with the
group informing them about the dangers that may be encountered and how to
avoid them? Why was this teenager allowed to enter the water unsupervised,
especially in this particularly dangerous section? Questions that we will probably
never know the answers to, but it does bring up the question about what is the
responsibility or partial responsibility of the leader of a group, either morally
or legally when heading into the wild, even if it is only a day hike.
It is not the parents responsibility to teach water safety, but they should inquire
about the experience of the group leaders who will be taking their children into
a potentially dangerous environment.
HST= Wilderness Adventurer who knows no bounds, except for their own imagination.

Have a safer backcountry experience by using the HST ReConn Form 2.0, named after Larry Conn, a HST member: http://reconn.org
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