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Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 10:36 am
by balzaccom
On our last backpacking trip, after spending a couple of days off trail and away from people, we arrived at a nice lake that is on a regular trail, seven miles in from the trailhead. Yep, we were going to have company here.

So we set up camp on a sandy ridge to the northwest of the lake, nestling our small grey tent in among a cluster of small trees. It was nicely obscured from view. That was a mistake. Nobody saw us there, and as other hiking groups arrived, they set up camp right next door. By nightfall we had four other groups camping near us, including two who were within 75 feet. The rest of the lake was empty, except for one group of young men on the far side.

So here's the question. When you arrive at a lake, which campsite do you take? If there is nobody there, do you take the best one? We do. But if someone is already set up at the best campsite do you take the second best site, even if it is quite close to the first one? Or do you follow the bus seating rule, which says that you take the site farthest from the person who is already set up?

And if you are third? Do you fill in the space, or do you try to find something farther away?

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:48 am
by Big Ed
If the best site is obscured, I'd still take it. I'd do something to flag my presence though, if concerned about close neighbors. Hang something from a tree.

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 1:07 pm
by SSSdave
What is the "best" campsite will vary between individuals. Reality is despite recommended policy against such, that the majority of campsites around lakes are right beside trails and not much more than the minimum 100 foot distance from the edge of lakes. In fact many well used sites at lakes are only 100 feet as measured by dwarf and midget's feet especially in national forest wilderness.

Since I don't like being near other groups, don't have the usual magnetic fixation of camping close to lakes, don't need a well manicured camp with log and rock furniture, nor really flat bump free tent spots, nor some elaborate stone campfire pit masterpiece, am likely to ignore all the obvious used sites and find something more remote. Oh we do sometimes camp in such spots but that is only when we are far out at remote destinations where we don't expect any others.

Recall a decade or so ago, 2 of us arrived at one of the more popular Darwin Canyon lakes. No other groups were around and we unwisely set up gear in an area of stunted whitebark pine next to the use route that had numbers of other campspots rather densely nearby. Well by late in the afternoon several other groups had arrived and ALL of them were communing by us. Finally a group of 3 arrived and plunked down on the other side of our trees.

We picked up gear piecemeal over 2 or 3 trips and crossed the stream opposite the north use route trail side where no groups, nada, zilch were. In other words every group that arrived on the trail after us noticed where people and groups were set up then commenced to join despite often being less than 100 feet from others. None bothered to go across the stream, down at other ends of our lake on the trail side, nor climb up to the bench about 100 feet above. All noticed where groups seemed to be plunking down and joined that gregarious behavior apparently without any consideration.

Same kind of thing happened a few years ago on the shores of East Lake. So those and a few other such experiences over the decades has taught me to NOT to camp at well used beat up sites unless it is too much hassle not too. And that most groups ironically prefer to camp in such "lake and trail side cities" versus the otherwise vast empty areas of wilderness. The largest such I know about is the (ridiculous to me) concentration one finds along the trail on the northeast end of Thousand Island Lake. Why do so many have that behavior?

David
http://www.davidsenesac.com/Summer_2015 ... 015-1.html

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 1:33 pm
by Big Ed
There are many types of people, for all they knew you "wanted" company/conversation. I think if something is that important to us we need to communicate it, or be prepared to pick up and move.

I went by Thousand Island Lake once, and what you said really struck me. I've never seen that many people in the wilderness. They were shocked that I'd never been there before, like that was the only place to go or something.

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 1:57 pm
by freestone
Why do some many have that behavior?
Because they do not participate on this forum.

Another reason could be the area is lacking in flat ground. No one likes to sleep on a slant. if there are trees, the guy with the hammock rocks!

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 3:06 pm
by maverick
I would not have expected solitude, by staying at a lake on the main trail, only a few miles from the trailhead, especially at what Dave called a "best campsites" area. It is just human habit, not only to seek out convenience, but also to congregate, these are habits we humans are used to back in the civilized world, and most cannot shed this, even if they are in the wild.
If one is expecting solitude in such an environment, then they must take steps to ensure it, camp at a further distance from the shores, away from organized campsites, on the less popular or more rugged side of the lake, somewhere near the inlet creek, but a distance from the lake.

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 3:27 pm
by Brien
I guess I've always been lucky. I seem to get the spots I want and haven't encountered any nearby neighbors. When backpacking I really like my solitude and if I see someone in the area I'm looking at I'll just keep walking. Eventually I'll find a nice spot still within a short walk to a water source.

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 3:34 pm
by cslaght
I must say, I am pretty much in agreement with the desire of solitude. I am not in any way, shape, or form a "congrager" (whatever that word is!). Lately, my trips have been in pairs, and have not had really an issue with people camping next to us. Weaver Lake in Jennie was a bit crowded with my wife and I a couple of years ago, we were there first and had the lake to ourselves except for a group of boyscouts that were daytripping on the other side. As the afternoon wore on, other people filled up with most of the established sites the west shore, but we still had our solitude. Whomever I'd go with, we always sought out a little rougher, farther, less convenient area precisely to avoid such experiences. The worst (and a learning experience, though it wasn't so bad) was Memorial weekend 2009, my family (4 of us) had Mehrten Meadow (Alta trail out of Wolverton) to ourselves on Friday night. Saturday, there weren't less than 30 people there, camping right on top of us. A bit annoying and inconvenient, but not the worst thing that can happen. So, if there's a vote, count me in for solitude! :whistle:

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 4:39 pm
by DavePloessel
the above problems are one of the main reasons I prefer OFF trail or less traveled areas. I (we) go to the mountains to get away from it all. Sometimes, you are left with little choice (crowded weekends, limited water sources, etc) and conditions crowd people together. in thise instances, if I am "first" to an area, I pick best site. If I am second, third, 4th, (shudder) 5th, I prefer to continue hiking, but if conditions force me to stop, I pick the farthest practical spot from anyone who has arrived before me. It's common courtesy (plus I HATE it when you have an entire lake and someone sets up 5 feet away and wants to chat).

Notable exceptions would be when setting up in an are that has a designated "camping area" and setting up elsewhere would cause unjustifiable damage to the area around you.

my take.

Re: Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:15 pm
by sekihiker
I don't usually go out during holidays except maybe July 4 and I've never seen anyone in the back country on July 4. I've been out for six days this summer and have seen just two people, a man and his son.