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Ultra lighters bear canisters?

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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby RooPhillip » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:09 am

Thanks to all for what you've posted here. I've learned a ton from this thread.



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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby maverick » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:19 am

Nice job with the bag Hobbes.
HST= Wilderness Adventurer who knows no bounds, except for their own imagination.

Have a safer backcountry experience by using the HST ReConn Form 2.0, named after Larry Conn, a HST member: http://reconn.org
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby mediauras » Thu Jul 26, 2012 12:17 pm

Yeah, nice quilt Hobbes. And you find that the ridgerest provides enough insulation for you? I've recently been considering a 30* quilt for summer use, I'm a side sleep and really like to spread out, but I haven't been sure what kind of pad would provide the right warmth. I alternate between a Mt Washington CCF pad, and an older prolite plus (I'm also a pretty warm sleeper.)

Sounds like you're also not cooking your food. Man, I love cooking (not just rehydrating) and eating a hot meal at the end of the day!
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby The hermit » Fri Jul 27, 2012 7:23 am

Hobbes what do you do when mosquitoes are swarming?
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby Bluewater » Tue Jul 31, 2012 2:40 am

Hobbes your Sierra quilt is beautiful! I realize we sometimes dress alike while hiking, but the quilt thing has gone too far :) I recently used the same M50 shell/liner material for a MYOG summer quilt (1" baffles).

back.JPG
summer quilt


When the mosquitoes are swarming I use a Hexamid Solo Tent for a UL shelter. It's a fully enclosed six sided shaped tarp with netting (http://zpacks.com/shelter/hexamid.shtml). At 8 ozs it's the lightest fully enclosed shelter I could find. Joe @ Zpacks used one for the entire PCT.

I have been using the Klymit Inertia inflatable 3/4 length sleeping pad (5.5 ozs) along with a Gossamer Gear 1/8" insulation pad (2.5 ozs) and slept comfortably down to 25 degrees.

I also like a hot meal at the end of a long day. I've had a great time using the Caldera Keg-F. It's been called the Jet Boil of UL stoves, although it's only useful for boiling water (coffee or re-hydrating meals). It takes a few minutes to boil 2 cups of water and one esbit tab is enough to boil 4 cups of water (1/2 oz per tab). The stove itself w/ the stove/pot stand/wind screen/pot/lid/pot cozy weighs about 3 ozs, and it works in the wind. I boiled water and had some coffee on top of Whitney using this thing earlier this summer.

Just my UL 2 cents, hopefully helpful to anyone trying to save some weight. If you are interested here's a link to a detailed 8.25 lb base weight gear I used on the JMT last summer. It rained straight for the first 4 days and I was warm, comfortable and dry:

http://seatosummitultralight.blogspot.c ... -list.html
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby overheadx2 » Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:04 pm

I agree with the safety factor. While not quite an ultra lite guy, On 4 day trips I don't pack more than 25 lb's, and never more than 28 pounds Including water for 5 to 7 day trips. I am amazed at how easy it is to catch yourself when your foot slips, or catching an ankle twist.

Most importantly, I don't do well at altitude, and find that if I carry less than 28 lb's, sickness very rarely occurs. Back when my pack was 45 pounds, I could count on being sick to some degree the first night. I actually quit hiking for about 10 years due to altitude sickness until I met a guy that turned me on to UL hiking. To be honest, I can't remember what I brought that would make my pack 45 lb's. I think most Packers would be surprised at how much excess they pack in. I certainly don't go without safety or comfort.
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby ndwoods » Thu Aug 02, 2012 6:12 pm

Not an ULer, but my base weight is only 12 lbs and my total weight for 9 days is 30....and I carry a bearikade.
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby Wandering Daisy » Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:23 pm

I am ONLY interested in the final weight I carry on my back. I pack everything I carry and get on the scale, subtract my weight. The clothes I wear, my shoes, the trekking poles for me are not critical. It is my poor old aching back! On my Wind River trips this summer I carried a bear cannister (Bearikade weekender), although it was not required. Weight on back = for two 14 day ration periods, total pack weight 38 pounds, one 12 day ration period, total weight 35 pounds. I also carried 11 oz bear spray (grizzly country) and 8 oz fishing gear. Also this year there were campfire restrictions so I had do all cooking on a stove so took a bit more than normal fuel. I am an extrodinarily cold sleeper so I have a 5-degree bag. My "base weight" is pretty high compared to UL - it is around 20-22 pounds. I save weight on food. 1.25 pounds per day. And I rarely carry more than 1/2 liter of water. I can see reducing by about 5 pounds but at this point am not willing to spend the $$ to get new stuff. I think everyone who wants to reduce weight needs to look at their "sacred cows". Mine is my sleeping bag. Next bag I buy probably will be lighter. For some it is water. If you carry 2-3 liters of water, why? Compare that weight with the weight of a filter that you can use at each water stop. For some it is extra food - do a few day fast and prove to yourself that you can do without for a day if needed.

Also if you do not WANT to reduce weight, then OK. Everyone has different criteria and goals. But I think almost everyone will agree that a lighter pack on the trail makes walking easier and more enjoyable. The question is how much are you willing to carry for "camp comfort". To each his own. And if you have not looked at some of the new gear out there, you may want to take a peek at some of the really nice light-weight stuff.

I do disagree with a few comments above. In bear country, you DO NOT want to put anything but food or stuff you will NEVER have on you or in the tent inside your bear can. Anything put in the bear can picks of food smell. The other is the idea that implies weight=safety. Safety is depended on taking JUST the right amount of stuff, not too much or too little. Most of us take too much and what we take has lighter equally good alternatives. Another is that you need a hefty sleeping pad just because you are old. You need the R-factor for warmth approriate to the climate you will be in. I find that most aches and pains backpacking are due to being out of shape, not old. This summer I did a 40-day hike and hurt the first 2 weeks then everything adapted and I slept very comfortable on the x-small pro-lite pad (8 oz), using my pack as pillow and a 2x2 blue square pad (2.5 oz) at the foot. And I am well over age 60. I would much rather take a few Advil if I ache than carry a 1.5-pound sleeping pad. And if you carry a lighter pack, I doubt you would ache as much.
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby Cross Country » Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:42 pm

I agree with Tallmon.
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby Hobbes » Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:43 am

Wandering Daisy wrote:A 2x2 blue square pad (2.5 oz) at the foot. I would much rather take a few Advil if I ache than carry a 1.5-pound sleeping pad. And if you carry a lighter pack, I doubt you would ache as much.


Daisy, you are already a ULer, even if you don't realize it. The first symptom is recognizing that man/women wasn't designed to be a pack animal. Rather, we evolved as super-lean long distance walkers/runners on the African savanna. Carry a lot of weight, and your body will react in a myriad of negative ways. Sure, you can get away with punishing your body when you're young, but the margins disappear as you age.

Secondly, you're now weighing items down to fractions of an ounce. Once you start doing that, there's never any going back. :D Thirdly, lightweight isn't a compromise on safety - it's merely taking advantage of new(er) fabric technologies. Silnylon is probably the greatest thing since sliced bread. Infusing silkweight nylon with combinations of silicon, teflon, etc results in incredible strength & water resistance.

If you're budgeting food @ 1.25lbs/day, and you had 2 two week periods, then your food would have weighed around 17.5+- lbs for each segment. My base weight with bear can & rod is 9.5 lbs (6.4lbs without either), so my total weight before water would be 27lbs. Add in +- liter, and I'd be around 29lbs.

I have a MYOG 25-30 degree quilt, so add another .5 lbs of 900 FP down to get to 5-10F. I also have a MYOG pack that weighs 9 oz, but is only good up to 20 lbs. To carry above 30 would require stays (ie internal frame) and heavier construction, so bump it another .5 lbs as well.

Taking into consideration everything above, I'd have around a 30lb complete weight. Yours is really not much different, other than perhaps a heavier rain outfit + bearspray, etc, so I'd have to conclude that you are officially a ULer.

I'd wager the next time you do a semi-short Sierra trip your pack weight will come in pretty light. Welcome to the club!
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MYOG

Postby Hobbes » Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:14 am

I apologize for once again getting on the soapbox, but the real key to getting (ultra) light is learning how to make your own gear (MYOG). By purchasing fabric direct and eliminating labor+taxes, even the most expensive project will a cost a fraction of retail.

I tell people that if you've ever changed a spark-plug, or baked a pie, you can learn how to sew. While I don't attempt to make clothing, a bag/quilt, tarp/tent & pack are the staples of any MYOG person. Sewing machines only have to be able to do straight stitches, so you don't have to spend over $100 for a functioning machine.

I've bought 1st quality silnylon from this guy in CO to make some packs and solo & 2-man tarptents:

http://myworld.ebay.com/eastie2117/?_trksid=p4340.l2559

And of course Paul @ T-H carries great kits:

http://thru-hiker.com/kits/quilt_kit.php

My advice for anyone that is interested is buy some cheap nylon from Joanns and practice making stuff sacks:

http://thru-hiker.com/projects/silnylon_stuffsacks.php

Stuff sacks incorporate everything you need for larger projects in terms of seams, hems, etc, so once you can comfortably pound these out, you can then move up to actual gear.
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Re: Ultra lighters bear canisters?

Postby Shhsgirl » Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:00 pm

Two years ago I did the first section of Roper's Sierra High Route, starting at Copper Creek. I carried a Bearikade, and saw a number of UL'ers whiz by. Talked to a few of them, and not one was carrying a canister, or even an Ursak. They all had OP bags, and slept with their food. I felt pretty skunked, lugging along my canister. This year, at age 63 and a spinal fusion later, I am doing the second section, from Snow Tongue to Italy Pass or so, and am carrying an Ursak All-White, probably with the aluminum liner. But I'm not sleeping with my food (I don't like it THAT much!).
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