How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

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rlown
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Re: How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

Post by rlown »

have a good trip! err on the side of extra snacks..

oh, and post a Trip Report with pics when you get back..
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kpeter
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Re: Two

Post by kpeter »

gregw822 wrote:(Also, if you carry freeze-dried, the vacuum packaging is odor-proof. Has to be. If molecules of the air could get out, they could also get in, hence the product wouldn't stay vacuum packed. If the small molecules that make up the air can't pass through pores in the packaging, then neither can the larger molecules responsible for food scent.
Don't count on this, though. Bears that learn to associate food with humans are attracted to the smell of humans as well as their food. Even if the food is airtight you won't be. It is not that they want to eat you, it's just that your odor tells them food is near. Once they arrive they will depend on their memory and vision to sample any freeze dried dinners they see lying around, even if they are odorless (until they rip them open.)

Odor-proofing food can't hurt, and it seems to be enough in areas where the bear's have not learned to associate food with humans. I use opsaks instead of cannisters in Idaho, for example. But Sierra bears are better educated.
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gregw822
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Re: How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

Post by gregw822 »

I won't say you're wrong, but I'm very skeptical of this. Bears have poor eyesight, and I doubt most Sierra bears in the wilderness ever see enough humans to imprint a memory of a condensed foil pouch as food from one year to the next. A habituated bear? Maybe, probably... who knows? I'm not so sure of myself that I lose due caution. My food goes in the canister, and I always carry a canister. On occasion I'm out long enough that not quite everything fits in the canister. I have relegated non-food smellies and freeze dried packs to opsaks stashed outside camp. So far, so good. Honestly, I've been doing this for many years, and I've seen bears only a few times, and have never, that I know of, had one in my camp. This goes back to pre-canister days when we would hang food in stuff sacks from trees. Doesn't mean it will always be the case, but what I've done so far to keep a safe camp has worked perfectly. Still, my advice is to keep a scrupulously clean camp and use your bear canister.
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AlmostThere
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Re: How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

Post by AlmostThere »

gregw822 wrote:I won't say you're wrong, but I'm very skeptical of this. Bears have poor eyesight, and I doubt most Sierra bears in the wilderness ever see enough humans to imprint a memory of a condensed foil pouch as food from one year to the next. A habituated bear?
Haven't been to Yosemite?

Bears break into cars to investigate empty ice chests, bags of shoes, cans of oil (for the car), and will drag away your backpack in some parts of the park, regardless of what's in it. Even if you empty out your backpack and leave it open the bears around Tuolumne Meadows will try to take it. Signs on the board at the backpacker camp instruct you to put your pack inside the lockers for that reason. I do not doubt that leaving a mountain house pouch sitting somewhere would result in a fed bear. They will sneak up behind you and snatch it away while you are prepping for dinner, in Little Yosemite Valley. They'll warn you not to turn your back and treat the bear locker like a fridge. Don't leave things out, don't leave the locker open.

I think the bear problems correlate with increased human presence, and there are more and more people along the JMT, PCT, and in the wilderness areas - the bear lockers are where the problems are the worst.

Even if you think the problem doesn't exist where you are, don't take the chance. The more chances you give the bears, the more likely there will be a problem.
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gregw822
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Re: How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

Post by gregw822 »

Of course you're right, but you did notice that I included a caveat about habituated bears? The campgrounds in the Valley and Tuolumne aren't even close to being wilderness areas, and neither, for that matter, are most of the one-nighter destinations in Yosemite.
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oldranger
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Re: How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

Post by oldranger »

Greg

My theory is there is no such thing as a food container that does not have odor. Those sealed freeze dried meals had to be open and accumulate some odor in the process of filling. Really wild bear probably respond as much to your odor (I don't mean to imply that you stink :D ) as much as food and you may cause them to be cautious and stay clear. But having had a bear pull a beer out of a creek (it was under a rock, too) and sink his teeth into it and finish it off is proof enough to me to expect a bear to have a nose for food (and drink) items we would swear had no odor.

Mike
Mike

Who can't do everything he used to and what he can do takes a hell of a lot longer!
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gregw822
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Re: How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

Post by gregw822 »

Mike,

Fair enough. I've never been sickened by drinking unfiltered Sierra waters either, which I've done all my life. I guess my life in the wilderness mirrors the charmed life I seem lead back in civilization. Ah wait...l I know... I don't drink beer. That must be the secret.

But I do stink when I'm in the woods. Even I can smell me. :)

Greg
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Flux
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Re: How many bear canisters for five 2 nights?

Post by Flux »

Those freeze dried meals that say 2 servings?? I eat the whole dang thing no problem. I try to plan on 800 give or take calories for dinner.

The Single Serving Pro-Paks have more calories per serving, probably like 600. Those could do fine with a snack too.

Last couple times out with a partner, we made early dinner and late dinner, splitting one of those freeze dried 2 person servings at each.

My bane though is that I get hypoglycemic, or I get all goofy when I run out of calories so I need to constantly eat, like once an hour on the trail. I learned my lesson, you just constantly eat and drink and always take a bit too much food. I also look for high calorie/oz foods. You should try to average about 125/oz. Typically I have a couple top-ramens, power bars, and this or that left when I leave. hiking on an empty stomach with a heavy pack is not great at all.
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