High Sierra Topix

I don't think it's a point of contention or controversy. The article is from 04/16. Has anything changed since then from a woman's perspective? I also didn't see a comments section on the ELLE website, but I would wager that the subject will get more productive and meaningful traction here than it ever would've gotten there.

So is this all boiling down to form and function, or as the article's title asks, "Why Should I Have To Wear Pink While I'm Hiking?"

John Harper wrote: ↑Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:15 am

mrphil wrote: ↑Thu Oct 18, 2018 6:36 am In my world, with the women I know, there is never a trip that doesn't involve a shopping trip beforehand. I go when I need fuel canisters, they go for something new and cute, and I have a very hard time believing that they're the exceptions to the rule. In fact, I lean more towards the idea that they're status quo. It perpetuates the stereotype and the problem. If you want something to change, you withdraw your support until the message becomes loud and clear.

It's obvious you've bought into the stereotype.

John

Actually the women I spend time with outdoors buy the gear they need that does the job. My daughters bought men's wading boots because they fit. One bought mens waders the others women's because they were the right price and fit. They bought raingear that I recommended and did not cost an arm and a leg. Their clothes when backpacking are clothes they already own. My wife never buys clothes specifically for an upcoming trip. Sorry mrphil has to put up with women more concerned about fashion than function.

Despite all of this, one woman friend of mine is a very serious outdoors person. You know how some people have one favorite color for clothing? Hers is pink.

The good news is that we never have lost her.

oldranger wrote: ↑Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:47 pm Sorry mrphil has to put up with women more concerned about fashion than function.

I wouldn't necessarily say that I have to put up with it, I just get a kick out of it. She can do what she wants. I'll give her my input when asked (fishing for compliments), and the only time I'll intervene is if it obviously isn't going to "work". She does "fashion", I do practicality and safety. If she can effectively get from Point A to Point B, what color she's wearing doesn't matter at all. And while pink is her favorite color, and always a top clothing contender, whether she already owns it or buys it new, who am I to talk? Hell, I've been know to hike in only boots, a t-shirt, and my SpongeBob boxers.

bobby49 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:24 pm The good news is that we never have lost her.

That, is funny! There is definitely no blending in involved. A real rescue helicopter pilot's dream.

All color preferences aside though, what I'm most curious about is in how the quality and function of women's clothing differs from men's, be that in concerns conveyed by wives for the men's understanding of it, or better yet, directly from the venerable women of this forum. Is it fit, pockets, zippers, construction...? I guess what I'm asking is, as far as clothing designed for women specifically is concerned, what would you change to make what you have and ultimately need better?

And my wife prefers earthtones for her hiking gear--among other reasons, because when she answers a call of nature, she doesn't want to stand out in a forest...

mrphil wrote: ↑Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:04 amAll color preferences aside though, what I'm most curious about is in how the quality and function of women's clothing differs from men's, be that in concerns conveyed by wives for the men's understanding of it, or better yet, directly from the venerable women of this forum. Is it fit, pockets, zippers, construction...?

That's a good question. I'll have to ask my wife her opinion. She's also not a member of your stereotype and cares primarily about function.

The article was focused on color. And it isn't just women who care about color. If men's clothing were available only in black, gray, and navy blue I wouldn't be happy with that. Functionality is the most important thing to me but color matters. It matters to most people.

I have to say that this quote from the Elle article caused me to drop my opinion of the author a notch:

Then there's the outright disdain. A few years ago, during a class on backcountry navigation, our male instructor asked each person to estimate their typical hiking speed. When I came up with a rate of 4 miles per hour (brisk, sure, but not blistering), he rolled his eyes and announced to the whole group that I must have miscalculated—nobody my size could maintain that pace.

In reality, some research suggests that women may have an edge over men in extreme endurance sports, especially long-distance swimming and hiking. Our bodies burn energy more efficiently over the long haul, and researchers also speculate that women use better judgment in the wilderness—we're less likely to overestimate our abilities and crash midway through a race. If we are so well suited for the outdoors, why can't we find equipment to match?

She was clearly wrong about her hiking speed estimate, which isn't a big deal in itself. But she tried to hang it on the instructor as a kind of male fault, even attempting (but failing) to point to evidence that women are superior at extreme endurance (the newspaper article she linked to did not reach that conclusion). And this assertion had nothing to do with her otherwise minor error. It suggests n heightened sensitivity to gender issues.

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She quickly went well beyond her subject and took it into a sort of man-bashing/gender war rant (and I know rants!). I stopped caring what she had to say.

"I have to say that this quote from the Elle article caused me to drop my opinion of the author a notch:"

Right from the start, no sunshine being blown at all, if I was any party wanting to know about the pros and cons of all things women's gear, I would talk to people like Daisy or AT, although I would imagine that the average Elle reader would still end up at REI anyway, or maybe just skim the article before moving on to the next one.

Yeah Rightstar, I don't even have to open it to know which thread you're talking about. That was sad and whiney, with absolutely no introspection at all. Just an imaginary bone to pick and a real chip on her shoulder.

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