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Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby Satsuma » Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:25 pm

rlown wrote:Here's a concept.. This is the wrong time of year to even think of burning given the lack of rain. Just get over the campfire concept. It's not that hard.

Bring your stove.. make sure there's no punk near it, and cook your food that way.

Why is this hard?

It is not hard but some food cooked on the real fire taste better. And sitting near the fire at cold night also gives some pleasant feeling, which is part of being in wilderness. And to have fire once in few days to burn some paper packaging, candy wraps and such is also good.It would not be same pleasure without any fire.



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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby AlmostThere » Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:55 pm

Satsuma wrote:
rlown wrote:Here's a concept.. This is the wrong time of year to even think of burning given the lack of rain. Just get over the campfire concept. It's not that hard.

Bring your stove.. make sure there's no punk near it, and cook your food that way.

Why is this hard?

It is not hard but some food cooked on the real fire taste better. And sitting near the fire at cold night also gives some pleasant feeling, which is part of being in wilderness. And to have fire once in few days to burn some paper packaging, candy wraps and such is also good.It would not be same pleasure without any fire.


And all those things are largely a matter of opinion. I take pictures and report people who MUST have a fire when there's bans - I prefer not to have my favorite areas turned to an ash covered wasteland just so someone can experience a "pleasant feeling."

It's possible to have a wonderful experience without lighting a single twig. You plan for it, you live with it, and - like I have - you alter your expectations and presto! It's not a trip-ruiner at all.

DO NOT burn paper packaging that has plasticized liner such as is popular to do these days with all manner of food wrappers - plastic burning is TOXIC to you and the environment. PACK IT OUT.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby mediauras » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:00 pm

yeah, seriously, don't burn your trash. pack your toxins out.

http://www.fs.fed.us/t-d/pubs/pdfpubs/p ... dpi300.pdf
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby Satsuma » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:50 pm

AlmostThere wrote:I prefer not to have my favorite areas turned to an ash covered wasteland just so someone can experience a "pleasant feeling."

Come on. We never make a new ash area, always reuse existing one, which serve many people for many years. I make a point to teach my children to make a fire and to cook simple food on the fire. You never know what could happen in future with them. You can't always rely on stoves and gas, it could be some disaster, when skills to make a fire and to cook something would be life saving. And also fire could help you stay warm.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby Satsuma » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:53 pm

mediauras wrote:yeah, seriously, don't burn your trash. pack your toxins out.

http://www.fs.fed.us/t-d/pubs/pdfpubs/p ... dpi300.pdf
Thanks for the link. Interesting, I never thought this way.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby Tom_H » Tue Jul 30, 2013 12:21 am

Take only memories. Make only pictures. Leave only footprints.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby bluefish » Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:51 am

To each their own; I haven't had a fire in the Sierra since '80. I tremendously appreciate those who practice LNT. I at least like the illusion that an area isn't overrun with people. Fire rings attract trash and toxins and invite more fires . When all the consumable material is gathered in an area, people are tempted to burn things that are questionable and damaging to the surroundings, LNT looks to the future , other methods of camping are for those that only see the present. It's not the least bit of surprise to me that when I've been rudely disturbed by other hikers at night with loud noise and noxious behavior, fires were at the center of it.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby AlmostThere » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:10 am

Satsuma wrote:
AlmostThere wrote:I prefer not to have my favorite areas turned to an ash covered wasteland just so someone can experience a "pleasant feeling."

Come on. We never make a new ash area, always reuse existing one, which serve many people for many years. I make a point to teach my children to make a fire and to cook simple food on the fire. You never know what could happen in future with them. You can't always rely on stoves and gas, it could be some disaster, when skills to make a fire and to cook something would be life saving. And also fire could help you stay warm.


Don't mistake what I am saying - campfires ARE A LEADING CAUSE OF FOREST FIRES.

I have had to douse many, many, many poorly put out fires. Some had rejuvenated themselves and were licking away at charred sticks left in the ring.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby Wandering Daisy » Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:57 am

I agree that learning to build a fire AND properly put it out is an important wilderness skill. It should however, be practiced in an area with plenty of on-ground wood, in a safe already established fire pit, and during weather/seasonal conditions when forest fire risk is low. Perhaps if those who build fires were taught how to do it properly, campfires would not be the leading cause of forest fires.

I think the point AT was making that she has observed people totally ignoring regulations and building fires when conditions are not safe. I happen to like and use campfires, but honestly, they are a lot of work to do properly. If you are not willing to take the time or know how to do this, then use the stove. I figure building a fire to cook on adds about 1/2 to a hour to camp chores. But then, for some of us, these "chores" really are pleasure.

Few people put out fires properly. You really have to get dirty to do this. Douse the fire, stir, get your fingers in the pit and FEEL for temperature. Particularly feel around the rim of the fire pit. Make sure there are not tree roots in the bottom of the fire pit. Also before making a fire, clear off all burnable material 3-5 feet away. Look up - do not build a fire under tree branches.

Twice a campfire has saved my sorry self. But most of the time a campfire is needed, you have to know how to build it with wet wood. This is not a skill you learn by building a few recreational fires. I learned this after 35 days one horrible June, when it snowed every day and we were totally relying on campfires to cook. (The "old days" in the 60's). Believe me, we would have loved to have stoves! It was work, work, work! And constant anxiety.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby Satsuma » Tue Jul 30, 2013 8:43 am

We do backpacking every summer for more then 40 years, and so our many friends. Of course all of us know how to do it properly and we never seen a fire caused by people. Current Aspen fire started because of lightening.
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby 87TT » Tue Jul 30, 2013 9:38 am

I guess the point everyone is trying to make is, if you get used to not having a fire, it's not as important as you think. I like campfires myself but if I can't or more importantly "shouldn't" then I'm not all bummed out. I live in the mountains and am always worried about fires until the rains start in the fall/winter. I have been evacuated and had to leave my house twice because of fire adn there was no "lightening". Now if I couldn't have my coffee in the morning............. :paranoid:
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Re: Where camp fires are not allowed this season?

Postby Satsuma » Tue Jul 30, 2013 9:47 am

I agree, it is not that important, and we would continue backpacking even if fire is never allowed. We always comply the rules, never leave trash and so on, and make fires only in existing rings on lower altitudes and always bring many pots of water from the creek or lake to shut down the fire when we are done.

This thread was very useful for me, it gave me some other point of view.

What do you do in mountains after dinner when it is cold and you are wet after raining? Having fire those days is so helpful! We did JMT last August, and it was raining practically every day.
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