High Sierra Topix

This morning went to the El Dorado National Forest website to see what their current process was for wilderness permits and found they are the first to my knowledge with a complete online process. Well of course other national forests may have recently moved to this same process also as I am not aware of goings on in the USGS. Historically each NF has dealt with wilderness permits through their own processes thus we backpackers have always needed to contact specific NF's to understand what to do.

I now have a reserved permit for a 9-day mid July backpack in SEKI over Sawtooth Pass so have made plans for one 2-day and one 3-day warmup backpacks during June. This online permit went smoothly. They have a well designed page showing whether or not quotas are yet filled per wilderness zone. Then after that is checked, at http://www.recreation.gov" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; one fills out the usual permit info, even a checkbox for those bringing up fido, pays online via credit card, gets an ok, then later the permit is sent via email. The above is a 2-day weekend trip out of the Wrights Lake trailhead up to Grouse Lake. Will likely drive up Friday after work, pick up the permit from a nightbox, and then night hike up the easy 2 mile 1200 foot vertical trail. Mind numbing how different things are today versus decades ago.

If anyone is interested here is a link to a lot questions one may have about the
process with all the answer to them.
http://www.recreation.gov/marketing.do? ... trans.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Inyo was setup like this last year. It is much, much easier to check availability and get permits now. I am a big fan of the system.

schmalz wrote:Inyo was setup like this last year. It is much, much easier to check availability and get permits now. I am a big fan of the system.

Me too. I got reservations for Onion Valley and Rock Creek later this year, and it was quite painless.

ETA: Re Eldorado NF, it looks like they don't have online permit reservations for Mokelumne Wilderness--just Desolation.

I love recreation.gov. I hope Yosemite starts using it for issuing permits in the near future.

SSSdave wrote:Will likely drive up Friday after work, pick up the permit from a nightbox, and then night hike up the easy 2 mile 1200 foot vertical trail. Mind numbing how different things are today versus decades ago.

You don't actually need to pick up a permit for Desolation Wilderness. The email allows you to print the actual permit, unlike Inyo NF where all you get is a confirmation to take into the permit issuing station. Even before the online system, Desolation sent out permits in the mail, not just confirmation letters.

tim wrote:...You don't actually need to pick up a permit for Desolation Wilderness. The email allows you to print the actual permit, unlike Inyo NF where all you get is a confirmation to take into the permit issuing station. Even before the online system, Desolation sent out permits in the mail, not just confirmation letters.

Yeah noticed that later on the confirmation email which is great for any of we experienced folk. What it does relate however is one must wait until within 15 days of an entry date before returning to their website, logging in, and printing the permit out. Likely to make sure visitors have recently read policies. From now on when I phone up or visit any of the other parks and forests, am going to be asking what they know about how far along they are in implementing this new system. Since there are numbers of us here on this board, if others do likewise it will be useful to have Eric post that info as stickys.

This is particularly going to effect this person by making weekend backpacks far more doable. For years I've been whining about how weekend backpacking for we urban Californians is unworkable. I simply will not bother dealing with a 4+ hour drive each way for a weekend backpack if that means I have to listen to some sermon at 8am Saturday morning when I might otherwise be 3 hours up some trail approaching whatever destination where I might have enough time to make it all worthwhile. Actually since I'm an enthusiastic night hiker, would often be setting out on Friday evenings after leaving work moving up trails so I might wake up at destinations as dawn rises.

Since they will be using a national database, that will eventually allow them to distinguish between novices and frequent enthusiasts which is good. Understandably some parks and forests ie Yosemite may continue to want visitors to come in for face to face sermons because they simply do not trust either novices or enthusiasts as too many of the latter in this era break rules left and right because they know there is little enforcement. Others may trust enthusiasts but not novices so the database will allow them to distinguish between the two instantly and thus allow some to get permits through USPS mail while others are asked to come in for a sermon. Another benefit of a national database is they ought to be able to flag those who have been cited for backcountry issues and use that to either over a penalty period deny permits or at a minimum force them to always come in for a sermon. Once many of those that tend to bend rules understood how that worked, it would certainly put a chill on such behaviors that this person would welcome.

Of course the primary use of the database is for the much larger numbers of people requesting outdoor campground reservations. And of course numbers of loud obnoxious inconsiderate visitors who frequent public campgrounds is legend. A database will make their heretofore anonymous obnoxiousness a thing of the past.

David

I think the main issue is the NPS regulations which require an in person briefing (no night boxes). Desolation is not adjacent to any National Parks whereas Inyo NF is.

The reason for saying return within 15 days of the trip to print the permit is that up till then you can cancel and get back a refund for everything but the $6 booking fee. That's good because it means more people will bother to cancel and the permits can be rebooked by someone else. With the previous paper system I bet a lot of permits went unused because there was no straightforward way to change/cancel a permit (except in person at the FS office).

SSSdave wrote:
Yeah noticed that later on the confirmation email which is great for any of we experienced folk. What it does relate however is one must wait until within 15 days of an entry date before returning to their website, logging in, and printing the permit out.
David

This is not working for me. Yesterday I reserved a permit for Desolation. Just an overnighter on Saturday. I have been waiting for my permit to be e-mailed to me but all I read is that I have to pick up the permit at the issuing station. I have logged back onto Recreation.gov but I still can't print out the permit.

I wonder what I did wrong? I 'm pretty sure I printed out a permit for my trip to Maude last October.

Thanks,

-Russ

OK, if you have this problem call the forest service at the permit issue station.

I spoke with Susanne Johnson at the Lake Tahoe Basin Management Unit. She printed out my permit, scanned it and then just e-mailed it to me.

Thanks Susanne!

-Russ