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self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby AlmostThere » Wed Sep 22, 2010 6:54 am

After October - November, you can list the national parks in there too. You can self register and also camp places where camping is forbidden during the summer, like Glacier Point, Mariposa Grove... I'm probably going out in October to Kings Canyon when self registration comes into effect - scribble, drop the copy in the slot, hike. Yosemite's self reg season starts in Nov.



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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby bheiser1 » Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:54 pm

I've seen on the official national park sites that, as you pointed out, the permit system is more open in the winter months. But they just say "winter". And you mentioned "November", etc. Are there specific dates people can plan on or does it vary by snowfall etc each year?

Also, how about a few other key areas:
- north or south from Ebbetts Pass, Carson Pass, or Sonora Pass?
- the Ansel Adams trailheads from the Clover Meadow area?
- the Saddlebag Lake entrance to Hoover Wilderness?
- John Muir trailheads around Florence Lake, Bear Diversion, etc?

Anyone know specifics of these as it relates to self-issued permits?

'course if I can point to specific official referneces for these it'd be even better, but word of mouth is a starting point :)

This is my first foray into the World of Wikis, so its' rough, but here's a start:
http://cawilderness.wikispaces.com/

I'm not sure how well it will work, but we can give it a shot. Comments/suggestions welcome :)
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby AlmostThere » Fri Sep 24, 2010 7:43 am

The Clover Meadow area will be inaccessible once the road closes (snow). I suspect that will be true of any of them - Kaiser Pass road closes when snow falls heavy enough to stick. And the risk of having your car snowed in back there increases the later it gets.... We got a snowfall of about an inch the first week of October that made the road impassable for a day, last year (was at Mono Hot Springs, and down it came, and all the folks without chains hustled out to slip and slide up the road). I think Kaiser is the only one flagged for snow travel, and snowmobiles go in from time to time to resupply folks like the guy wintering at Mono Hot Springs.

SEKI self registration begins on Sept 26. Yosemite actually varies - the TM wilderness office starts self registration in mid-September, Big Oak Flat and Wawona are self reg after September, the Badger ranger station is only open December - March, Hetch Hetchy you register at the gate with the staff year round. (This is per the wilderness office page - no dates are listed.)
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby rlown » Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:22 am

bheiser1 wrote:I've seen on the official national park sites that, as you pointed out, the permit system is more open in the winter months. But they just say "winter". And you mentioned "November", etc. Are there specific dates people can plan on or does it vary by snowfall etc each year?

Also, how about a few other key areas:
- north or south from Ebbetts Pass, Carson Pass, or Sonora Pass?
- the Ansel Adams trailheads from the Clover Meadow area?
- the Saddlebag Lake entrance to Hoover Wilderness?
- John Muir trailheads around Florence Lake, Bear Diversion, etc?

Anyone know specifics of these as it relates to self-issued permits?

'course if I can point to specific official referneces for these it'd be even better, but word of mouth is a starting point :)

This is my first foray into the World of Wikis, so its' rough, but here's a start:
http://cawilderness.wikispaces.com/

I'm not sure how well it will work, but we can give it a shot. Comments/suggestions welcome :)


You planning on maintaining this wiki? I'm not sure why you don't just point to a current list of NPS/USFS url's and be done with it, and maybe refresh the HST permit page. Are you serious about talking about November? That becomes a personal choice, involving lots of snow, and pointless for the permit discussion. They're all open.. Di.., er ski at your own risk..
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby bheiser1 » Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:15 pm

Hmmm, well ... the idea was (being on a Wiki and all) that it develop into something maintained by the community ... just like wikipedia.

Yeah, links to usfs sites could be part of it ... but given how vague the various sites are, that's of limited use.

I guess I mis-judged how this idea would be received... oh well!

So am I really the only one who thinks of my weekends as a time to be "free", do things (including weekend backpacking trips) spontaneously, not planned weeks in advance?

p.s. I didn't say I would backpack in the Sierra in November ... I was just asking for specific dates for the permit system. :)
Last edited by bheiser1 on Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby AlmostThere » Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:18 pm

bheiser1 wrote:
So am I really the only one who thinks of my weekends as a time to be "free", do things (including weekend backpacking trips) spontaneously, not planned weeks in advance?


Not at all. I go spontaneously all the time. Just today someone called up and said "let's go to Mineral King for four days this Friday!"
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby bheiser1 » Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:22 pm

AlmostThere wrote:Not at all. I go spontaneously all the time. Just today someone called up and said "let's go to Mineral King for four days this Friday!"


So how did you get your permit? :)
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby rlown » Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:25 pm

bheiser1 wrote:Hmmm, well ... the idea was (being on a Wiki and all) that it develop into something maintained by the community ... just like wikipedia.

Yeah, links to usfs sites could be part of it ... but given how vague the various sites are, that's of limited use.

I guess I mis-judged how this idea would be received... oh well!

So am I really the only one who thinks of my weekends as a time to be "free", do things (including weekend backpacking trips) spontaneously, not planned weeks in advance?


Don't get me wrong.. wiki's are great but, unless moderated, the information is as bad as a very old thread on a forum for conveying solid information.

There is a permit page on this forum is at http://www.highsierratopix.com/411_perm ... tions.html

If you discover great stuff, beyond the two URL's on that page, you should take that page, bulk it out, and submit it to Eric for possible publishing.

You almost always have to call, in my opinion, to understand permitting in a specific area, or be prepared to try and get somewhere on the day before to get a walk-in permit. I like self-registration, but that would mostly in low use trailheads.
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby bheiser1 » Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:30 pm

OK, thanks for that link. This is all rather frustrating to say the least ... a forced requirement yet an archaic system for its users... maybe I'm just cranky about it right now because I stayed home this weekend, in spite of the beautiful weather, mostly because I didn't have a permit to go any of the places I had in mind for the weekend (was hoping for a high sierra destination since before long it'll be covered in snow). I was super busy at work all week, and simply didn't have time to research to find the right trailhead, search around to find the right ranger station to call, and then actually call around during business hours to find a permit. <sigh>...
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby AlmostThere » Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:04 am

bheiser1 wrote:
AlmostThere wrote:Not at all. I go spontaneously all the time. Just today someone called up and said "let's go to Mineral King for four days this Friday!"


So how did you get your permit? :)


Permit? It's after Sept 26. We drive out there, write a little on a piece of paper, and hike. Self reg period for SEKI...

:thumbsup:

And if it weren't... we would drive out there, talk to the ranger in the wilderness center, get a permit for an open trailhead, and go wherever we could. Never gone out and not gone backpacking because I could not get a permit.

For areas like Yosemite leaving an itinerary with someone is as easy as texting - reception is okay in the valley and at Tuolumne Meadows - so if we are just wanting to go backpacking and did not have a reserved permit, we drive out and get whatever we can get. There are usually ample slots for some trailhead or other, and sometimes, you just get lucky at 10 am when they release the unclaimed reserved permits.

SEKI I am less familiar with cell phone reception spots.... But it is easy to leave a note saying "I am going to mineral king, I left my itinerary (whatever it will be) with the ranger out there."
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby bheiser1 » Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:37 pm

Hmmmm, cool ... glad to hear it's so easy. I guess my pov is, I need to drive 4-5 hours to get there, so it's not worth going and risking not getting a permit... or spending all of my Saturday (half my weekend) to hunt down ranger stations where I might find one... assuming the stations are even open when I arrive.

Anyway it seems I'm the only one with this issue, the rest of you have this all figured out so it works for you. Thanks for the feedback :).
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Re: self-issued permits at wilderness access points?

Postby rlown » Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:43 pm

you must have pop-ups blocked or don't look at your PM's.. On the top bar, there should be a # messages indicator.. Sent you one a while ago..

Unfortunately, during the high season, on certain trailheads, you're gonna waste a day, if you expect self-issue, depending on where you're going and when.. I often waste a day anyway in travel and camping high the first night to acclimatize. Accept that you're gonna waste Friday driving. Plan on a great meal or two on the way and the scenery..
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