Cleanliness of Lakes?

[lockmangabriel]

From what I've heard a lot of the lakes in the High Sierra, especially lakes that receive little traffic, are considered to be clean and some people even drink from them without filtering (I wouldn't dare take that risk but that's just me). Is there any real risk to doing some washing of clothes or bathing with the waters of these lakes? Wouldn't want to somehow contract Giardia and end up ruining a trip...

[AlmostThere]

DO NOT wash clothes or use soap in lakes. That's how they become contaminated with chemistry no filter will remove. Take a container of water away from the lake (minimum of 200 feet) and wash off sunscreen etc before doing any swimming. Don't urinate in the lake. Don't urinate near the lake.

Some of the waters in the Sierra are now showing signs that people are urinating too close, or in, the water -- low levels of medications that people take (antidepressants for example) are showing up in the testing that is sometimes done to monitor water purity. Sunscreens and other chemicals are not removed from water by backpacker filters. Do your fellow hikers a favor and don't get in the lake without washing first. Wash clothes, dishes and anything else AWAY FROM THE LAKE.

[rlown]

+1 on AT's comment.

[kpeter]

While that is good advice, I don't think the OP was asking whether it was safe to wash clothes in the lake, but rather whether the lake water would somehow contaminate clothes or give you giardia if you swam in it. In other words, let's say the OP took your advice and washed off before getting in the lake, and used lake water far away to wash clothes. Is there danger in that?

I don't have a definitive answer, but 1) drying objects (like clothes) dessicates and kills a lot of microbes and I have never worried about washed clothes. Swimming in giardia infested waters could definitely give you giardia, but my guess is the risk is pretty low, particularly if you keep you head above water and avoid getting lake water in your mouth and eyes. The risk is probably higher when water skiing or swimming in most lower elevation lakes.

Swimming in alpine lakes, of course, can be very dangerous for other reasons that are not always understood by people new to high altitude waters, so be sure you know what you are doing.

https://www.mercurynews.com/2016/09/19/ ... erra-lake/

[rlown]

Acute giardiasis develops after an incubation period of 1 to 14 days (average of 7 days) and usually lasts 1 to 3 weeks. Symptoms include diarrhea, abdominal pain, bloating, nausea, and vomiting.Dec 9, 2017

CDC..

You'd probably be home by then...

[lockmangabriel]

While that is good advice, I don't think the OP was asking whether it was safe to wash clothes in the lake, but rather whether the lake water would somehow contaminate clothes or give you giardia if you swam in it. In other words, let's say the OP took your advice and washed off before getting in the lake, and used lake water far away to wash clothes. Is there danger in that?

I don't have a definitive answer, but 1) drying objects (like clothes) dessicates and kills a lot of microbes and I have never worried about washed clothes. Swimming in giardia infested waters could definitely give you giardia, but my guess is the risk is pretty low, particularly if you keep you head above water and avoid getting lake water in your mouth and eyes. The risk is probably higher when water skiing or swimming in most lower elevation lakes.

Swimming in alpine lakes, of course, can be very dangerous for other reasons that are not always understood by people new to high altitude waters, so be sure you know what you are doing.

https://www.mercurynews.com/2016/09/19/ ... erra-lake/

Thanks for the advice kpeter. Also tragic to hear about his death. I'd imagine that he got a little too far out in the water, negating the fact that aerobic activity is much higher at elevation, and then ended up losing the stamina required to keep himself afloat, but who knows...

[SSSdave]

Drank unfiltered water all last week during our 9-day trip out of North Lake over Piute. Doing so for decades never having issues, just using common sense in selecting sources as has been discussed on this board numbers of times.

And I also jump in lakes or streams almost every day regardless of how cold water is. There is no danger like that link kpeter made because most high country water is too cold for "swimming" thus we get in and out quickly. Even getting in and out quickly like a jack-in-the-box on steroids makes a huge difference in how one feels afterward. That noted, there are a few lower elevation lakes like Kibbie and Many Island that by late August are quite pleasant for actually swimming in.

I put on DEET and sunscreen only a single time during our trip just on face, wrists, hands as I otherwise dress fully, not the t-shirt and shorts type, so easily washed off before taking a dip. And of course nothing in those lakes is going to harm your skin except if a Nile crocodile jumps up and chomps on your head.

Also never use soap when washing socks, about the only thing I ever wash. Did shampoo my wild man's hair once and did so using my 32 ounce Nalgene and 70 ounce Platypus way out on pleasantly sunny boulders.

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=18796

[kpeter]

Thanks for the advice kpeter. Also tragic to hear about his death. I'd imagine that he got a little too far out in the water, negating the fact that aerobic activity is much higher at elevation, and then ended up losing the stamina required to keep himself afloat, but who knows...

The coroner determined it was "freshwater drowning" and noted that the water temperature was 52 degrees. A common problem in alpine lakes is that the sun warms a shallow layer at the surface, but if a swimmer should go deeper he can suffer shock and hypothermia quite quickly. Temperatures that don't sound that bad since we mistakenly compare them with air temperatures can be life threatening when in water.
http://www.coldwatersafety.org/WhatIsCold.html
That is one reason I was watching with concern last week when I saw a girl swim halfway across Soldier Lake at 10800. Kibbie at 6500 late in the year could be a different story.

[franklin411]

It's a risk.

From the CDC:

How long does Giardia survive in the environment?

In the soil
In cold temperatures (around 4°C/39.2°F), Giardia can survive for approximately 7 weeks (49 days).
At room temperature (around 25°C/77°F), Giardia can survive for approximately 1 week (7 days).

Dry vs. moist surface or environment
In a dry, warm environment that experiences direct sunlight, Giardia can survive for only a few days
In a moist, cool environment, Giardia can survive for up to several weeks.

Water
In water temperatures below 10°C/50°F (for example, lake water or puddle water during the winter, refrigerated water), Giardia can survive for 1–3 months.
In water temperatures above 10°C/50°F (for example, river water during the fall, tap water, and puddles during the summer), Giardia can survive for less time than in colder temperatures. For example, in water above 37°C/98.6°F, Giardia can survive less than 4 days.

https://www.cdc.gov/parasites/giardia/p ... -pets.html

[freestone]

I would say the the risk is 0 at seldom visited lakes, assuming you are swimming or washing clothes on the surface (really?), Don't giardia cysts have a tendency to sink to the bottom (away from the ultraviolet light?) and the concentration dried on the skin or cloth would be below threshold to cause sickness?

+1 to AlmostThere for reminding us that no matter what, a bit of "you" always winds up in the lake including the sunscreen and residual soap and sharing "you" with others is what makes people sick, not giardia .

I wonder, are we trying to live too clean, to the detriment of good health?