Wilderness Permit Information

[balzaccom]

Looks Like Hoover Wilderness has new rules--they sent me this today

Important Update for Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forest Wilderness Permits


All Humboldt-Toiyabe Wilderness permits will be available to print at home within 7 days of the entry date. Please check your recreation.gov account as your entry date approaches.

Additionally, the remaining half of our quota will be released online, 3 days in advance of the entry date. These permits will be available to print immediately.

Please print your permits before you make your trip to the Hoover Wilderness. Printing services may not be available in the local area.

Once your permit is printed to PDF no changes can be made. You are responsible for printing and maintaining a hard copy in your possession for the duration of your trip.

[BSquared]

Clearly I'm coming into this discussion very late, but (a) I live far away (Vermont), and (b) my questions are a bit different. So here goes:

My wife and I had planned to join a couple of other people for a week-long trip in northern Yosemite (Green Lake entry) beginning mid-July, but the other two people pooped out, and so we decided it would make more sense for us to find a place a day or so in to base-camp for two to four days and do day hikes. We'll first spend a few days with a friend in Lee Vining doing day-hikes (at higher altitudes) to acclimate. But by this time, of course, every single east-side trailhead we might use for a one-day-in base camp, from Twin Lakes on south past Whitney, shows as "WP"-only on recreation.gov. But our schedule is now pretty flexible, so that might be doable. The question is how doable. So here are my specific questions. I tried a few Forest-Service numbers and couldn't get through (The Yosemite NP people seem to have their web act more together and the "walk up", i.e., lottery, system seems fairly clear), and I didn't see any answers on this thread, but I might have missed them so forgive me if so:

1. Would it be possible to get a permit for a popular Inyo trailhead like Shadow Lake or Onion Valley by "walking up" at the appropriate time, or is that simply ridiculous?
2. Where does one go to "walk up?" When? Are lines likely to be long?
3. Are walkup permits available at all in advance, e.g., the next day, or do we have to show up at the ranger station (whatever ranger station that might be) packed and ready to hit the trail?
4. How do the answers to these questions differ between Inyo NF and Humboldt-Toiyabe NF?

Bunch of questions, I realize, but I suspect I'm not the only one who might find themselves in this position...

[maverick]

Hi BSquared,

Here is the info:
Inyo: https://www.fs.usda.gov/main/inyo/passe ... recreation

[TurboHike]

Clearly I'm coming into this discussion very late, but (a) I live far away (Vermont), and (b) my questions are a bit different. So here goes:

My wife and I had planned to join a couple of other people for a week-long trip in northern Yosemite (Green Lake entry) beginning mid-July, but the other two people pooped out, and so we decided it would make more sense for us to find a place a day or so in to base-camp for two to four days and do day hikes. We'll first spend a few days with a friend in Lee Vining doing day-hikes (at higher altitudes) to acclimate. But by this time, of course, every single east-side trailhead we might use for a one-day-in base camp, from Twin Lakes on south past Whitney, shows as "WP"-only on recreation.gov. But our schedule is now pretty flexible, so that might be doable. The question is how doable. So here are my specific questions. I tried a few Forest-Service numbers and couldn't get through (The Yosemite NP people seem to have their web act more together and the "walk up", i.e., lottery, system seems fairly clear), and I didn't see any answers on this thread, but I might have missed them so forgive me if so:

1. Would it be possible to get a permit for a popular Inyo trailhead like Shadow Lake or Onion Valley by "walking up" at the appropriate time, or is that simply ridiculous?
2. Where does one go to "walk up?" When? Are lines likely to be long?
3. Are walkup permits available at all in advance, e.g., the next day, or do we have to show up at the ranger station (whatever ranger station that might be) packed and ready to hit the trail?
4. How do the answers to these questions differ between Inyo NF and Humboldt-Toiyabe NF?

Bunch of questions, I realize, but I suspect I'm not the only one who might find themselves in this position...

Inyo "walk up" permits are reserved on recreation.gov, they are not available this year face-to-face at one of the visitor centers. Go to this link:

https://www.fs.usda.gov/main/inyo/passe ... recreation

Click on the banner that says "How to reserve a permit". Read the section that is titled "What does the 'W' mean?".

Basically, you can reserve the "walk up" permit two weeks before your trip, i.e., the walk up quota becomes available then.

Edit: Maverick beat me to it!

[BSquared]

Doh. Well that was easy! Thanks!! I guess I'd expected to find that information at recreation.gov.

[wildhiker]

Clearly I'm coming into this discussion very late, but (a) I live far away (Vermont), and (b) my questions are a bit different. So here goes:

My wife and I had planned to join a couple of other people for a week-long trip in northern Yosemite (Green Lake entry) beginning mid-July, but the other two people pooped out, and so we decided it would make more sense for us to find a place a day or so in to base-camp for two to four days and do day hikes. ...

If you have a permit already for Green Lakes entry, you can still use that for your base-camping idea. They really don't care what you do once you enter the Wilderness, only that you enter on the date of your permit. I think you would find plenty to do for two to four days in the branches of Green Creek, going over the crest past Summit Lake to upper Virginia Canyon (Return Creek), and up to the pass to Virginia Lakes for the view. If I were doing this, I would probably actually have two base camps. First night an easy one to Green Lake so I could explore the next day on the use trail up Glines Canyon or the maintained trail to West Lake (or both). Then move camp to Hoover Lakes or even Summit Lake and explore into the upper reaches of Virginia Canyon or up to the pass over to Virginia Lakes. Lots of pretty lakes and dramatic peaks (both granite and reddish metamorphic rocks) in this area.
-Phil

[Wandering Daisy]

Just as an experiment, I pulled up the status of permits for July 4- two weeks from today. On the Inyo, most trailheads still had some available slots, including Lemark and Kearsarge. Bishop Pass, Piute, Cottonwood and a few other popular ones were filled. Then I went back one day (July 3 availability) and almost everything except the trailheads that are hardly ever used, was filled. If the walk-ins opened at 7AM today, mid day there were still many left; wait a day and most are gone. Not sure if this is the usual or a function of the 4th July holiday. My conclusion is that getting a walk-in at the top five trailheads has to be done at least the day of permit release. Wait a day and it is not much different waiting several days. The question now is if you could pick up a cancellation day of or day before by just showing up at the visitor center.

[northwesterner]

Just as an experiment, I pulled up the status of permits for July 4- two weeks from today. On the Inyo, most trailheads still had some available slots, including Lemark and Kearsarge. Bishop Pass, Piute, Cottonwood and a few other popular ones were filled. Then I went back one day (July 3 availability) and almost everything except the trailheads that are hardly ever used, was filled. If the walk-ins opened at 7AM today, mid day there were still many left; wait a day and most are gone. Not sure if this is the usual or a function of the 4th July holiday. My conclusion is that getting a walk-in at the top five trailheads has to be done at least the day of permit release. Wait a day and it is not much different waiting several days. The question now is if you could pick up a cancellation day of or day before by just showing up at the visitor center.

Hi - The permits for "top trails" went especially quickly for the July 3rd departure date. This seems to be a function of the holiday weekend. I snagged Shadow Creek at about 8AM on Saturday morning. It was the last permit available.

****
To the other comments on here about the loss of "walk up" availability and spontaneous trips, I understand and I sympathize.

But that wasn't a great system. Particularly if you work during the week (as I do, in Los Angeles), lining up at 7:15AM to try and snag a walk up permit was always a terrible system. The ranger stations would open at 8. If you were in Bishop, there would be two people there to process. If Mammoth, usually just one person. I don't know that I ever got out of there before 9AM, which guaranteed a late start on whatever trail you were leaving from. If you had to ride the Devil's Postpile shuttle, forget about being on the trail anytime before 10AM.

At least now, I know I can log in at 7AM 14 days before, and get the permit I need, have it emailed to me before the trip, and hit the trailhead at a more reasonable time.

I do agree with the concerns about losing the spontaneous weekend trips. For future years, I'd prefer to see these continued to be processed on rec.gov rather than in the ranger station. But perhaps they could meter them out a little better to preserve the walk up / last minute trips. Maybe release half of the remaining inventory 5 days before and the remaining half 2 days before departure. The people angling for those permits would be more committed to actually turning up on the hike than even those with a 14 day window.

****
For other jurisdictions - SEKI, Sierra NF, Hoover - the rec.gov conversion this year is a big improvement. The midnight on March 1st thing for SEKI was a crazy scramble, though usually walkups were available if you hit the ranger station at the time it opened (no small feet if you had to be at Road's End at 7AM). I was always nervous about trying to walkup to the Sierra NF ranger stations - they are a long drive into the forest and there was no guarantee anything would be left by the time you got there. Rec.gov solves that problem. As for Hoover, if you're coming from LA, like me, trying to do a walk up in Bridgeport was really inconvenient particularly if the trailhead you wanted was closer to Lee Vining. That's a lot of miles just to pick up a permit and the ability to get a 'walk up' 3-days out online is huge for someone like me.

The new systems aren't perfect. I believe improvements can be made. I also believe the price should be higher to support more enforcement in the back country. But the prior permitting process had a lot of issues and I think we're better off, overall, than before.

[sierradoug]

I'm confused. Or, alternatively, Inyo NF/recreation.gov don't have their act together.

I went to recreation.gov and "reserved" a permit. I got an email saying I could "receive" my permit by emailing them. I did, on June 14.

I got no email reply with my "permit" to print out. (Fortunately, I had decided to postpone my trip for other reasons.)

Then, today, I got an email saying I better hurry up and pick up my permit by 11:00 am today or I'd lose it. Pick it up at the ranger station! I thought I was supposed to "Print your permit before the No-Show deadline (10am on your entry date) or your permit will be canceled. Print, sign, and carry the permit with you on the trail."

If I'm supposed to print it myself, why are they saying I should pick it up at the ranger station?!

Obviously, I'd ask them all these questions if they ever answer their phone. No luck so far after calling six times today. Sheesh.

[astrogerly]

@sierradoug maybe it's a snafu in their system? Never had that issue happen and I've reserved many permits over the past two years and received via email since they changed to the new way of doing things.

Also, phone lines might be extra busy today with the Whitney Portal evac situation due to the fire. Yeah, it occasionally takes me a couple dials to get though these days, but they have extra stuff on their plates right now.